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I currently am using S1 ver 4 and a quantum, and when I output the DI to the Radial ProRMP through a sub, I'm not getting the same level as I do when I plug the guitar straight in. The level on the ProRMP is maxed and according to the net this is a known issue on this box. My question is, adjustment of the levels out from S1, I've tried a cue mix and just a normal out on the 3-4, but when I push the faders on the outs when reamping it doesn't seem to make much of a difference. Radial tech support said that this is what I should try. Maybe I'm doing it wrong?
My chain is as follows:
guitar->Radial J48->Quantum for recording DI
Quantum->Radial Pro RMP->Amp for reamping.

Any help on this would be appreciated.
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by matthewgorman on Wed May 08, 2019 9:37 am
I probably do it wrong, but I reamp from my interface to a di, to the amp. I haven't used a reamp box.

You could try to put the DI in the signal path after the RMP, and use the -15db pad to bring the gain down.

Matt

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by Jemusic on Wed May 08, 2019 6:39 pm
The DI is not actually required in the re-amping process. The Radial ProRMP is a passive re amping box. It takes the high level line level signal from your interface and drops it down to guitar levels suitable for an amp. It is transformer isolated and provides the right input impedance to match the output impedance from the Quantum.

I would be using a TRS balanced lead from either the main out or one of the other line outs from the Quantum to an XLR male connector to go into the preamp pedal. The RMP is expecting +4 dBu as well coming towards it. Is the Quantum set for those output levels. I assume it is already.

Check as per the instructions as well. e.g. plug your guitar directly into the amp and set for a modest level or basic overall level. Then connect the re-amp pedal from Studio One and play the guitar track you have recorded. After adjusting the control on the RMP both levels should be very close.

A proper balanced lead from Quantum to the RMP will add 6 dB of signal level compared to an unbalanced connection. An unbalanced lead may be messing up the RMP input impedance as well. Even with a balanced lead if the Studio One-reamp level is way down maybe you are tracking too quietly and need to record louder.

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by PresonusAaron on Thu May 09, 2019 3:20 pm
I am currently using a balance TRS to XLR to the Reamp box. Now when you say that "The RMP is expecting +4 dBu as well coming towards it. Is the Quantum set for those output levels"? Where can I verify that level is set correctly?

I am tracking my DI's at about -12 db.
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by Tom B on Thu May 09, 2019 6:14 pm
PresonusAaron wroteI am currently using a balance TRS to XLR to the Reamp box. Now when you say that "The RMP is expecting +4 dBu as well coming towards it. Is the Quantum set for those output levels"? Where can I verify that level is set correctly?

I am tracking my DI's at about -12 db.


I also have a Radial ProRMP, and have not experienced the same issues with low levels. I can usually match the guitar vs ProRMP levels at the amp really closely. Here are some thoughts:

Definitely good that you have balanced out from the Quantum to the ProRMP.
Your tracking levels sound fine to me. I have used a wide range of DI'd average levels in StudioOne -- with signals in the "-" high teens, anywhere from -20dB to -15dB. The peaks are usually in the single digits. But, there's plenty of wiggle room. Probably could run the average level even lower. I have the ProRMP's 'output level' control backed-off from the max and set around noon.

I'm not familiar with the Quantum, but as mentioned in the above post(s), definitely make sure the output operating level is set to +4dB. My RME allows +4dB and -10dB output. Setting it to -10dB is too low. The Quantum specifications show a max output level of +18dBu. It's likely to have an operating level setting or some kind of output level adjustment. Don't know where to point you, other than the manual or tech support.

BTW, my ProRMP XLR connector could have a tighter fit. I'm sure you've already checked the connections.

Hope this helps.

Edit: Added Quantum out spec and emphasized output level.

-Tom

Studio One Pro 4.1.4, Win7 Pro, I7-950 3GHz, 16GB RAM, HD5450 Graphics dual 1920x1200, RME UFX (Firewire), UAD-2 PCIe, Waves, Melodyne Editor.
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by Tom B on Fri May 10, 2019 12:01 am
I performed some measurements on the output levels of my RME interface and ProRMP. I'll try not to report much math :)

Theoretically, when StudioOne shows 0dBFS on the meter, my RME interface should produce around +4dBu at the outputs. Sometimes manufacturers will add some extra headroom (i.e. higher output).

The interface manual says the RME Fireface has lots of headroom when operated at "+4dBu" and seems to run past +10dBu on the outputs when StudioOne shows 0dBFS on the meters. :shock: This means my ProRMP is being driven with a stronger signal than expected.

PresonusAaron: hopefully, you'll get an answer about setting the Quantum output +4dBu or slightly hotter. Once you get to this point, the guitar amp can always be dialed to add a bit of extra gain if needed.

-Tom

Studio One Pro 4.1.4, Win7 Pro, I7-950 3GHz, 16GB RAM, HD5450 Graphics dual 1920x1200, RME UFX (Firewire), UAD-2 PCIe, Waves, Melodyne Editor.
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by Jemusic on Fri May 10, 2019 1:10 am
Most Pro audio interfaces do not output +4dBu at 0 dB FS at all. More like +18 to +22 dBu. My RME has a massive output at 0 dB FS. The idea is you run them at the FS levels that produce +4dBu and that is often -14 to -20 dBFS on pro interfaces. Quantum will be in the same boat.

Just checked and Quantum is +18 dBu at 0 dB FS. Meaning at -14 dB FS you be seeing + 4dBu at the outputs. (These dB FS figures are rms levels too NOT short term peaks. In these measurements though the signal is measured at the top of the sine wave, not 3 dB down which is where traditionally rms values are calculated)

Sometimes you do just need some math.

(To the OP. Insert a Level Meter during tracking (either on the inputs or on a channel insert) and set it for K System K14. While you are playing your guitar the bar graph should be reaching 0 dB VU on the scale. If its not, then you are not tracking at high enough level. Dont sweat the short term peaks, its the rms values that are all important)

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by Tom B on Fri May 10, 2019 2:37 pm
Jemusic wroteJust checked and Quantum is +18 dBu at 0 dB FS. Meaning at -14 dB FS you be seeing + 4dBu at the outputs. (These dB FS figures are rms levels too NOT short term peaks. In these measurements though the signal is measured at the top of the sine wave, not 3 dB down which is where traditionally rms values are calculated)

Wow! The Quantum has more output than the way I'm setting my RME which generates +13dBu (at +4dB operating level). The OP should have plenty of voltage to drive the ProRMP.

Jeff, as usual, good tip about how to set the DI guitar recording levels in StudioOne.

-Tom

Studio One Pro 4.1.4, Win7 Pro, I7-950 3GHz, 16GB RAM, HD5450 Graphics dual 1920x1200, RME UFX (Firewire), UAD-2 PCIe, Waves, Melodyne Editor.
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by PresonusAaron on Fri May 10, 2019 3:40 pm
Thanks for the info all, I will give some of these ideas a try and let you all know.
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by Jemusic on Fri May 10, 2019 3:44 pm
The RMU UFX delivers +17 dBu at a 0 dB FS level. Which is also pretty decent. So -13 dB FS will generate +4 dBu at the output. What this means is if you average an internal DAW rms level of say -18 dB FS the output will only be -1 dBu. Which is still pretty high.

I see the specs also quote input level sensitivities as well which is interesting.

My first impressions of reading the Quantum manual is the output levels are not switchable (e.g. +4/-10) as they are on the RME for example. The Quantum output levels are fixed. e.g. -13 dB FS will produce +4 dBu at the outputs.

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by PresonusAaron on Thu May 16, 2019 10:15 am
Ok, part of my issue was that the Radial ProRMP has a known level issue, so I modded it and now the level is good. However, I still cannot find where you change the level of a sub out to -11 or +4, does anyone know where that's at?
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by Jemusic on Thu May 16, 2019 2:04 pm
If you are talking about the Quantum I think its output level is fixed at +4 dBu

Please add your specs to your SIGNATURE.
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Specs i5-2500K 3.5 Ghz - 8 Gb RAM - Win 7 64 bit - ATI Radeon HD6900 Series - RME HDSP9632 - Midex 8 Midi interface - Faderport 8 and 2018- Atom Pad- iMac 2.5Ghz Core i5 - Sierra 10.12.6 - Focusrite Clarett 2 Pre & Scarlett 18i20. Studio One V4.5, Notion 6.5, Ableton Live 10, LaunchPad Pro
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by Tom B on Fri May 17, 2019 3:34 pm
PresonusAaron wroteOk, part of my issue was that the Radial ProRMP has a known level issue, so I modded it and now the level is good. However, I still cannot find where you change the level of a sub out to -11 or +4, does anyone know where that's at?

I'm curious about the mod you made to the ProRMP. Is there information you can share (e.g. a web site, etc.)? I looked inside the unit and see it could be as simple as adjusting one of the resistors which attenuate the signal. Suppose I could contact Radial too.

-Tom

Studio One Pro 4.1.4, Win7 Pro, I7-950 3GHz, 16GB RAM, HD5450 Graphics dual 1920x1200, RME UFX (Firewire), UAD-2 PCIe, Waves, Melodyne Editor.

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