StudioLive RM32Ai and RM16Ai Mixers & UC Surface with QMix Ai
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Please bear with me. I'm jumping into the whole cascading thing kinda late in the game, as when getting the RM32AI, thought Id never need a reason to use more then 32 inputs at once.

I have the RM32 and a used RM16 both plugged into a MOTU AVB switch, along with the PC and the wireless router as well.

After setting the Assigned IP addresses on each RM, bringing up UC Surface, on the tabs, the first tab is the first RM (32AI) mixer and the second tab is the 2nd RM (16AI) mixer.

Verifying the mute all for the first mutes all, and same for second.. and then testing an Analog channel on the first (RM32), and an Analog channel on the 2nd (RM16), both success.
So then I do the cascade steps

With the wireless router in teh AVB Switch as well, running UC Surface from the iPad, am able to see all 64 channels, the 48 analog and the 16 digital ones. Same from UC Surface on the PC

With what seems like everything is cascaded correctly, I'm running into an issue. Wondering if I'm still missing something I haven't been able to discover yet?

When testing the same mic in the same channel in the RM16AI pre cascading (success)
When doing/completing the cascade together for 48 mic inputs and 16 digital channels, all are fine on the first RM32AI mixer, but the 2nd used RM16AI isn't showing any input on any channels, using the same mic/PreAmp settings, set to Analog. This is just in Cascade mode. While separated, both RMs work fine for all inputs. Only when cascading, no longer see any Analog signal on the mic in the slave RM16.

Anyone have any thoughts?

So, might anyone know why I'm not getting any input on the 2nd RM while in Cascade mode??

PreSonus Studio One 6.1.1 Pro-64 Bit
Lenovo ThinkServer TS140, Win 10 64Bit, 28GB RAM, (4) SansDisk 480 SSD
Quad Core-3.20 Gigahertz Intel Xeon E3-1225, (1) SandDisk 240 SSD
Texas Instruments 1394 OHCI Compliant Host Controller, Firewire & Ethernet connection
RM32AI, RML16AI, FaderPort, Melodyne Celemony, JBridge, too many VSTs to list
SW5E AVB, iPad 4 x2, Netgear NightHawk AC1900 Router, Avid ElevenRack, ADAT Edit
Coleman LS3 Line Switcher, Goldpoint SA1X Stepped Volume Attenuator, pre Monitor switch
ATC SCM25A PROs 3-Way, Alesis Monitor Ones 2-Way, Avantone MixCubes 1-Way, ISO-PUCK 76's
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by wahlerstudios on Sat Oct 03, 2020 4:53 pm
Hmmm, I don't remember having seen this problem and I have no idea what the reason can be. Audio between the two mixers is transported via AVB/Ethernet, so there must be something wrong dealing with AVB. You could try this: Swap the option cards of the mixers and check if the behavior continues or if the behavior changes between the mixers. The original rack mixer option cards are identical, so this will cause no problems.

Another thing to try could be to estalblish the Master/Slave connection several times. Connect, unnconnect, connect, unnconnect... Leave a little time in between. And have you tried to select the RM16AI as Master? The rack mixers are using the same firmware?
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by michaelwalter on Sat Oct 03, 2020 5:37 pm
Thank you for some ideas!!
Yes, same 9244 firmware... and the correct version for each RM.
I did try the connect/disconnect, connect, etc a few times over, same deal.
if I use the RM16 as the Master, RM32 as the slave, same issue... see signal from the 32 but not 16.
However, Im hoping this might help some.
With an Analog mic in the RM32 and the PreAmp set as should be, I see the level in the channel, and signal on the MONO and MAIN in UC Surface.

I did notice that when an Analog is in the RM16, I see signal on the channel itself (33 thru 48) but no signal at either MAIN or MONO out, even though both Main/Mono buttons are selected on any of the channels.
When in Studio One and routing an already created track to one of the digital channels, I see signal on the channel (any 49 thru 64) but see a signal on the MAIN out, nothing on MONO, even tough both are selected on said digital channel.

PreSonus Studio One 6.1.1 Pro-64 Bit
Lenovo ThinkServer TS140, Win 10 64Bit, 28GB RAM, (4) SansDisk 480 SSD
Quad Core-3.20 Gigahertz Intel Xeon E3-1225, (1) SandDisk 240 SSD
Texas Instruments 1394 OHCI Compliant Host Controller, Firewire & Ethernet connection
RM32AI, RML16AI, FaderPort, Melodyne Celemony, JBridge, too many VSTs to list
SW5E AVB, iPad 4 x2, Netgear NightHawk AC1900 Router, Avid ElevenRack, ADAT Edit
Coleman LS3 Line Switcher, Goldpoint SA1X Stepped Volume Attenuator, pre Monitor switch
ATC SCM25A PROs 3-Way, Alesis Monitor Ones 2-Way, Avantone MixCubes 1-Way, ISO-PUCK 76's
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by michaelwalter on Sun Oct 04, 2020 10:35 am
This seems kinda odd, so I'm gonna put in a Support ticket as well, but wanted to see if anyone might have seen something like this before?

To make sure I'm not leaving anything out in the translation, Ive added a bunch of photos here
Both RM's are on 9244 firmware:
RM32AI on StudioLive RM32AI Firmware v9244 RM32_TC20_9244 RM32_9244.zip
RM16AI on StudioLive RM16AI Firmware v9244 RM16_TC20_9244 RM16_9244.zip

Ive tried on UC Surface 1.8, (no delay in seeing signal), and the newest UC Surface 3.2 as well (signal delay after 5-ish minutes), both versions do the same for seeing Slave RM Analog channels.
Ive tried with Cat5 and Cat6 cable, using the MOTU AVB switch
Port 1: PC
Port 2: RM32AI
Port 3: RM16AI
Port 4: Wireless Router

In UC Surface, Pre Cascade:
Photo 01: Showing on Tab1, the IP addresses set for the RM32AI
(I had purchased new back in last Oct 2014) - For easy tracking, set to 192.168.0.32
Photo 02: Showing on Tab2, the IP addresses set for the RM16AI
(I had recently purchased used a week or so back) - For easy tracking, set to 192.168.0.16

Still Pre Cascade
Photo 03: Showing an RM32AI Analog channel, 25, seeing the signal on the channel, as well as the "Main" and "Mono" outputs.
Photo 04: Showing an RM16AI Analog channel, 01, seeing the signal on the channel, as well as the "Main" and "Mono" outputs.

Set Cascading/Networking: (32 as Master / 16 as Slave)
Photo 05: Showing the RM32AI as the main, listed on the tab in the top left corner
Photo 06: Larger view of the Cascaded Mixer Setup
RM32AI 1 thru 32 RM16AI 33 thru 64

Using Cascading/Analog:
Photo 07: Same RM32AI Analog channel, 25 (as seen in photo 02), seeing the signal on the channel, as well as the "Main" and "Mono" outputs.
Photo 08: Same RM16AI Analog channel, 01 (as seen in 03, channel 33 now Cascaded), seeing the signal on the channel, but no signal at either the "Main" or "Mono" outputs.

Using Cascading/Digital:
Photo 09: As a test, tried playing from Studio One a previously recorded track, set to output on the first Digital Channel, 49. When playing from Studio One, can see signal on the channel, as well as the "Main" and "Mono" outputs.
Whatever the issue I'm missing is, its not allowing Analog to go thru, but Digital has no issue.

Reversing Cascade: (16 as Master / 32 as Slave)
Photo 10: Showing the RM16AI as the main, listed on the tab in the top left corner
RM16AI 1 thru 32 RM32AI 33 thru 64
The odd issue that happened here..
(10 photos max so not able to show this)
Where things were reversed, what was 33 on the original Slave was now channel 1 on the master, so when tapping that channel, go a signal as expected, seeing the signal on channel 1, and signal at both the "Main" or "Mono" outputs.
BUT...
What was channel 25 on the original Master RM32 would now be channel 57 on the now slave RM32... But when taping that channel, still shown signal on channel 25 from the 'slaved' RM32AI, nothing on where it should be, channel 57.

**
In Original M32 S16 cascade config, and thoughts on what might be keeping the Analog from coming thru to Main/Mono, with both set 'on', where the Digital has no issue? Am I missing a setting? Or is this just in need of a Support ticket?

Attachments
01.JPG
Photo 01: Showing on Tab1, the IP addresses set for the RM32AI
(I had purchased new back in last Oct 2014) - For easy tracking, set to 192.168.0.32
02.JPG
Photo 02: Showing on Tab2, the IP addresses set for the RM16AI
(I had recently purchased used a week or so back) - For easy tracking, set to 192.168.0.16
03.JPG
Photo 03: Showing an RM32AI Analog channel, 25, seeing the signal on the channel, as well as the "Main" and "Mono" outputs.
04.JPG
Photo 04: Showing an RM16AI Analog channel, 01, seeing the signal on the channel, as well as the "Main" and "Mono" outputs.
05.JPG
Photo 05: Showing the RM32AI as the main, listed on the tab in the top left corner
06.JPG
Photo 06: Larger view of the Cascaded Mixer Setup
RM32AI 1 thru 32 RM16AI 33 thru 64
07.JPG
Photo 07: Same RM32AI Analog channel, 25 (as seen in photo 02), seeing the signal on the channel, as well as the "Main" and "Mono" outputs.
08.JPG
Photo 08: Same RM16AI Analog channel, 01 (as seen in 03, channel 33 now Cascaded), seeing the signal on the channel, but no signal at either the "Main" or "Mono" outputs.
09.JPG
Photo 09: As a test, tried playing from Studio One a previously recorded track, set to output on the first Digital Channel, 49. When playing from Studio One, can see signal on the channel, as well as the "Main" and "Mono" outputs.
10.JPG
Photo 10: Showing the RM16AI as the main, listed on the tab in the top left corner
RM16AI 1 thru 32 RM32AI 33 thru 64

PreSonus Studio One 6.1.1 Pro-64 Bit
Lenovo ThinkServer TS140, Win 10 64Bit, 28GB RAM, (4) SansDisk 480 SSD
Quad Core-3.20 Gigahertz Intel Xeon E3-1225, (1) SandDisk 240 SSD
Texas Instruments 1394 OHCI Compliant Host Controller, Firewire & Ethernet connection
RM32AI, RML16AI, FaderPort, Melodyne Celemony, JBridge, too many VSTs to list
SW5E AVB, iPad 4 x2, Netgear NightHawk AC1900 Router, Avid ElevenRack, ADAT Edit
Coleman LS3 Line Switcher, Goldpoint SA1X Stepped Volume Attenuator, pre Monitor switch
ATC SCM25A PROs 3-Way, Alesis Monitor Ones 2-Way, Avantone MixCubes 1-Way, ISO-PUCK 76's
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by michaelwalter on Sun Oct 04, 2020 3:27 pm
Seems I'm not the only person to see this.
https://answers.presonus.com/12454/casc ... -dont-work

This ticket had 2 RM32AI's. Mine is 1 RM32Ai and 1 RM16AI. but same situation, no Analog on Slaves.

PreSonus Studio One 6.1.1 Pro-64 Bit
Lenovo ThinkServer TS140, Win 10 64Bit, 28GB RAM, (4) SansDisk 480 SSD
Quad Core-3.20 Gigahertz Intel Xeon E3-1225, (1) SandDisk 240 SSD
Texas Instruments 1394 OHCI Compliant Host Controller, Firewire & Ethernet connection
RM32AI, RML16AI, FaderPort, Melodyne Celemony, JBridge, too many VSTs to list
SW5E AVB, iPad 4 x2, Netgear NightHawk AC1900 Router, Avid ElevenRack, ADAT Edit
Coleman LS3 Line Switcher, Goldpoint SA1X Stepped Volume Attenuator, pre Monitor switch
ATC SCM25A PROs 3-Way, Alesis Monitor Ones 2-Way, Avantone MixCubes 1-Way, ISO-PUCK 76's
User avatar
by michaelwalter on Fri Oct 09, 2020 4:59 pm
PreSonus was inquiring on the AVB cards for this situation.
Curious, should the left one (the RM16AI that Im having the issue with) have a line thru the board number and be without a serial number?

Attachments
both-.jpg

PreSonus Studio One 6.1.1 Pro-64 Bit
Lenovo ThinkServer TS140, Win 10 64Bit, 28GB RAM, (4) SansDisk 480 SSD
Quad Core-3.20 Gigahertz Intel Xeon E3-1225, (1) SandDisk 240 SSD
Texas Instruments 1394 OHCI Compliant Host Controller, Firewire & Ethernet connection
RM32AI, RML16AI, FaderPort, Melodyne Celemony, JBridge, too many VSTs to list
SW5E AVB, iPad 4 x2, Netgear NightHawk AC1900 Router, Avid ElevenRack, ADAT Edit
Coleman LS3 Line Switcher, Goldpoint SA1X Stepped Volume Attenuator, pre Monitor switch
ATC SCM25A PROs 3-Way, Alesis Monitor Ones 2-Way, Avantone MixCubes 1-Way, ISO-PUCK 76's
User avatar
by wahlerstudios on Fri Oct 09, 2020 5:30 pm
I would say that both cards look identical. The white sticker might indicate that this card was bought separately, but I'm not sure. I add three photos. One shows the back of one rack mixer and how the original AVB option card looked. It had no AVB label. The other two photos are from an ebay auction showing the SL-AVB-MIX Option Card, which was needed for 16.4.2AI, 24.4.2AI and 32.4.2AI. Both cards are technically identical, at least that was always said...

Attachments
AVB_Card_1.jpg
AVB_Card_2.jpg
AVB_Card_3.jpg
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by michaelwalter on Sun Oct 11, 2020 6:15 pm
Thank you for the info!
The card showing the serial number is from the RM32AI that I had purchased from PreSonus directly back late Oct 2014.. The card with no serial number and the line thru the board model number is from the RM16AI that I had purchased somewhat recently via eBay.
I wasn't sure if it had made a difference of some sort, maybe if the line thru the board model number and missing the serial, maybe meant it was a bad card from manufacturing and shouldnt have come out into distribution?
Currently still working thru a ticket with a PreSonus Support Lead on my cascading issue of no audio on the slave device.
They had me switch the AVB cards on the devices, unfortunately same deal. Just cause, changed out the cabling to brand new CAT6 for all connections, unfortunately same issue.
Hoping for some promising news soon.

PreSonus Studio One 6.1.1 Pro-64 Bit
Lenovo ThinkServer TS140, Win 10 64Bit, 28GB RAM, (4) SansDisk 480 SSD
Quad Core-3.20 Gigahertz Intel Xeon E3-1225, (1) SandDisk 240 SSD
Texas Instruments 1394 OHCI Compliant Host Controller, Firewire & Ethernet connection
RM32AI, RML16AI, FaderPort, Melodyne Celemony, JBridge, too many VSTs to list
SW5E AVB, iPad 4 x2, Netgear NightHawk AC1900 Router, Avid ElevenRack, ADAT Edit
Coleman LS3 Line Switcher, Goldpoint SA1X Stepped Volume Attenuator, pre Monitor switch
ATC SCM25A PROs 3-Way, Alesis Monitor Ones 2-Way, Avantone MixCubes 1-Way, ISO-PUCK 76's
User avatar
by michaelwalter on Thu Oct 29, 2020 10:54 am
PreSonus Support techs are doing everything possible to assist, a lot of tests to try to find the issue at hand here. We've tried different RM Firmware versions -including the Beta, Different UC Surface versions, Different OS's, Different PCs, Different AVB switch, Different AVB Firmware, Different Router, Different IP Gateway's (192.168.x.x to 10.10.0.x), taking the PCs out -tested on 2 iPad's, changed all cabling, even tried switching the AVB cards between each.... but still no Analog signal on the Slave of the cascaded RM32AI and RM16AI. Doesn't matter which is set to Master/Slave. Whichever is set to Slave, no Analog out. Un-Cascaded, both work as expected.
Anyone think of a test we may not have tried yet?

PreSonus Studio One 6.1.1 Pro-64 Bit
Lenovo ThinkServer TS140, Win 10 64Bit, 28GB RAM, (4) SansDisk 480 SSD
Quad Core-3.20 Gigahertz Intel Xeon E3-1225, (1) SandDisk 240 SSD
Texas Instruments 1394 OHCI Compliant Host Controller, Firewire & Ethernet connection
RM32AI, RML16AI, FaderPort, Melodyne Celemony, JBridge, too many VSTs to list
SW5E AVB, iPad 4 x2, Netgear NightHawk AC1900 Router, Avid ElevenRack, ADAT Edit
Coleman LS3 Line Switcher, Goldpoint SA1X Stepped Volume Attenuator, pre Monitor switch
ATC SCM25A PROs 3-Way, Alesis Monitor Ones 2-Way, Avantone MixCubes 1-Way, ISO-PUCK 76's
User avatar
by Enigmax on Mon Apr 12, 2021 5:06 am
Hi, I don't have any other advice to offer but I can say I have the same set up and am experiencing the exact same issue.

I have a rm32 primary, and rm16 secondary, chained via firewire and also using a AVB switch for both and my mac. I can get them to master and slave in universal control, but i get no metering in UC at all. And worse, I get no input into studio one any more for any channels.

Did you get any successful results from presonus? I'd like to reference your support ticket if i can when i lodge my own.
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by wahlerstudios on Mon Apr 12, 2021 9:40 am
Cascading AI rack mixers is done via AVB (network), therefore both mixers need matching IP addresses. This is wrong in one of the screenshots in a previous post. I always used an Apple router and dynamic IP addresses and found one of my photos in an old thread, which shows the three IP addresses involved, one for the computer and two for the mixers.

It's not really important that the computer is connected to the AVB switch. The computer needs a FireWire 800 connection and UC Surface does not use anything else than the control information delivered via FireWire.

The IP address for the computer is only relevant for using Studio One in DAW Mode, which needs a CS18AI controller. UC Surface can not handle DAW Mode.

Hoep this helps. ;-)

Attachments
CS18AI.jpg
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by Enigmax on Mon Apr 12, 2021 4:43 pm
Wow, thanks for the fast reply! It looks like you have a heap of experience with these units.

I should have stated before I'm using a Presonus AVB Switch, which by the look of your other thread that it just doesn't work?

In any event, the IP addresses I have for the two units are:
* 192.168.0.4
* 192.168.0.36

They cascade, and I get signal up until track 32, but nothing on 33 onwards.

When you say the UC Surface can't handle DAW mode, what functionality is that specifically? We've been recording into studio one via the RM32 unit directly for years now, using UC Surface to manage preamps etc.

The whole goal of cascading the 2 units is to have 48 channels for recording instead of 32. Am I barking up the wrong tree here?
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by wahlerstudios on Mon Apr 12, 2021 5:18 pm
Yes, I had... ;-) I sold my CS18/RM32/RM16 when cascading became unstable. I used the RM32 on stage and the RM16 at FOH in order to use a computer via FireWire. The IP address problem was the only thing I could think of, when I read the previous posts. But that seems to be ok, you are using corresponding addresses.

I have no idea how to "wake up" the missing channels. There is a Facebook group for the AI rack mixers, but I don't know if the old Forum guys are still active there. Probably they're using different equipment nowadays.

Hope you get this solved. If you need to record 48 (or more) channels, only the 64S of Series III can do this. All other mixer (except the 16R) are 32-channel mixers. Cascading is no option, but you can use the 16 flex mixes as additional inputs and record 48+2 tracks in Studio One. Actually it's 32 channels, 16 subgroups, 4 FX sends and 2 Main L/R. It does need a second mixer like the 16R as input for the subgroups.
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by superbaudio on Mon Apr 17, 2023 12:10 pm
Was this ever resolved?
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by wahlerstudios on Mon Apr 17, 2023 3:26 pm
There has been a firmware update, but I have no idea what problem it has solved - or not. More important to know is that there is an "end of FireWire support and development". Check the Knowledge Base article, published Dec 6th, 2022.

https://support.presonus.com/hc/en-us/a ... evelopment

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