StudioLive RM32Ai and RM16Ai Mixers & UC Surface with QMix Ai
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Thanks for the updates Ray. On the Smaart spectrograph/RTA on remote clients...understood there must be a firewire connected computer. So the spectrograph display and the RTA would be extended to iPad/tablet clients? Any *rough* idea of when we might see UCS2 on Android?

Pat
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by stingray1122 on Wed Mar 15, 2017 11:17 am
Yes, with a computer connected via FireWire and both the computer and an iPad set to sync select mode, you'll have Smaart extended to the iPad. At least that's the goal. We still have to do the work to implement and test it.

UCS on Android is being tested now. If things go well it will be released at the end of May as part of the 2.1 effort.

RayT
Sr Product Manager
PreSonus
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by tourtelot on Wed Mar 15, 2017 11:29 am
Hey Ray. Even though I am annoyed about a lot of things Presonus right now, it is awesome to see your (and Presonus's) active participation on this blog. It is a testament to Presonus commitment to keeping people informed.

Thanks!!

D.
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by pattalbot on Wed Mar 15, 2017 11:29 am
Sweet...I just found your message from end of december outlining Smaart Go Remote...I never used the old SL apps, so I didn't have exposure. This will help me make changes to monitor EQ's without running to the rack/computer...good stuff.

UCS on Android will be a fun one...i've been wanting to go to a large format tablet to replace/augment my iPad2 and iPad3...but not wanting to shell out the money for the large iPad Pro. Guessing I can score a 11" or 12" Android tablet for much less lettuce. :thumbup:
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by Karyn on Wed Mar 15, 2017 5:55 pm
Ray,

With AVB we can use an RM as a stage box to an AI console where the aux sends on the console DIRECTLY map to the mix outputs on the RM and main output of the console DIRECTLY maps to the main outputs of the RM.

Can we PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE have those network inputs on the RM made available on Dante...

Karyn

-------------------------------------------------------
SL32ai, RM32ai, SL328AI x2, SL18sAI x2, all Dante.
Studio 192, Digimax FS, Faderport,
Sonar Platinum, Studio One.
http://refer.waves.com/dzDVn
Dante Level2 certified.
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by lancelyons on Thu Mar 16, 2017 11:27 am
Ray - thank you for chiming in.

A few quick questions for the Dante route..

1 - Will Dante observe the 96k sample size?

2 - Given the following products and Dante, can I connect everything so that the PC stays at FOH, and can record \ provide DAW playback \ VSTi special effects?

CS18ai
RM32ai
MOTU AVB switch
Wireless Router
PC running Studio One 3, with Waves and other VSTi's

3 - Can we still use UC surface remote so that FOH engineer can walk around with a wifi iPAD and control the RM32ai (including SMAART) along with talent using wifi iPADS on stage to control their own monitor mixes?

My desires and expectations given AVB originally were:

To be able to use the system to record with - it works but I have to run a snake right now from the control room to the main room. I have CAT 6 run between the control room and each recording area. AVB or Dante can take care of this, but I really want the 96k sample rate. It makes a difference.

To be able to take the DAW with us, using a click track, and use some instruments and play back tracks with the live performance.

To be able to use (some of) the same special VSTi effects in live performance as we did with the production tracks that will be played live.

To maintain the DAW, our two large screen touch monitors, and CS18ai at the FOH position and to be able to use UC surface for remote control. SMAART at these positions is a very very big plus.

To have talk back to the stage between the CS18ai and the RM32ai, and to play back pre and post show music.

Thats about it... And take care!


Lance

CS18ai, RM32ai+ MOTU AVB switch, MOTU 1248 AVB
DAWs - Sonar Platinum, Studio One
PC - home built
WIN 10
Intel i7- 6700K
Gigabyte Z170 UD5
Thunderbolt, USB C, Ethernet AVB ready, Firewire 400 and 800
32 gig Corsair DDR4
2 HD, 1 TB each
27" PLANAR touch screen
Buncha WAVES V9.2 64bit
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by sjc193 on Thu Mar 16, 2017 12:30 pm
^^
The only way to get 96k recording from an RM32 is to use the Firewire Card. (You do lose 2 FX in UCS though, maybe some other things not sure)

The daunte card that Presonus used only supports 44-48k. If I remember correctly it is a limitation of the card hardware itself and they can't fix it. (I know, total bummer)

Remote desktop VNC is a great way to control a stage FireWire recording computer from another computer at FOH which gives the Smaart RTAs/Spectrometers on UC Surface and can also be used to host VST effects. Because nothing actually is running on the remote computer (at FOH) it does not need to be expensive, a 200-300 computer can easily do it and can be connected to the large touch screens. All connected through regular old Ethernet switches and/or routers or add the Motu AVB switch for use of the CS18AI inputs and headphone jacks (CS18 will still control the RM without AVB if you don't need the inputs/headphones). This can be a solid setup if one takes the time to learn and understand how it works for only the cost of a cheap laptop. I use a RackMount PC with FireWire at Stage in the rack with the RM, no monitor, no mouse, no keyboard, it just looks like an Amp in the rack really, but once I let it boot up, I log into it with my iPad and I'm ready to go, can be done even easier with a computer at FOH if you want hard wire connected with Cat6.

Steve

StudioLive RM32AI
Rackmount Windows 8.1 PC Quad core 8G ram
ASUS RT-N66U Dual Band Router
IPad2, IPad Air 2, Studio One 3 Pro, 1 DBX Driverack 260
2 QSC KW 153's, 2 Turbosound TMS-1's
2 OHM MR450D Subs with Kilomax 18inch drivers
4 EV ZLX-12P's, 1 TurboSound iX15, 2 Yamaha S115V's
1 Crest Pro-Lite 7.5 (7500 watts) amp, 2 Behringer EP4000 amps
10 58/57 mics, 1 SM86, 1 sE8, 1 sE2200, 1 AT2020, 2 AT2021
1 beta52 kick mic, 2 e609, 2 Radial J48 DI's, 1 PRO48 DI
2 4Bar lights, 1 4Play, 1 6Spot, 1 fog machine
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by stingray1122 on Fri Mar 17, 2017 3:05 pm
Karyn wroteRay,

With AVB we can use an RM as a stage box to an AI console where the aux sends on the console DIRECTLY map to the mix outputs on the RM and main output of the console DIRECTLY maps to the main outputs of the RM.

Can we PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE have those network inputs on the RM made available on Dante...


If you're talking about the Stagebox modes being available via Dante, we have that planned. I don't have a date yet but we have it on the list for this year.

lancelyons wrote1 - Will Dante observe the 96k sample size?

I don't know if our Dante card solution can support 96kHz. I've asked Engineering to investigate the Audinate module implementation to get an answer.

lancelyons wrote2 - Given the following products and Dante, can I connect everything so that the PC stays at FOH, and can record \ provide DAW playback \ VSTi special effects?

CS18ai
RM32ai
MOTU AVB switch
Wireless Router
PC running Studio One 3, with Waves and other VSTi's

Yes. You would need to have the Dante Virtual Sound Card running on your PC.

lancelyons wrote3 - Can we still use UC surface remote so that FOH engineer can walk around with a wifi iPAD and control the RM32ai (including SMAART) along with talent using wifi iPADS on stage to control their own monitor mixes?

Yes expect perhaps the Smaart part. Currently you still need a computer connected via FireWire to run Smaart. With the update in April we plan to allow Smaart to be run on networked clients but the FireWire connected computer is still needed to run the Smaart processing. We're looking into running Smaart on a computer connected via Dante but I don't know yet if we can make that happen.

RayT
Sr Product Manager
PreSonus
User avatar
by lancelyons on Fri Mar 17, 2017 5:12 pm
Thank you Ray...

Hope you have a great weekend ahead.

Lance

CS18ai, RM32ai+ MOTU AVB switch, MOTU 1248 AVB
DAWs - Sonar Platinum, Studio One
PC - home built
WIN 10
Intel i7- 6700K
Gigabyte Z170 UD5
Thunderbolt, USB C, Ethernet AVB ready, Firewire 400 and 800
32 gig Corsair DDR4
2 HD, 1 TB each
27" PLANAR touch screen
Buncha WAVES V9.2 64bit
User avatar
by Karyn on Mon Mar 20, 2017 9:36 am
stingray1122 wrote
Karyn wroteWith AVB we can use an RM as a stage box to an AI console where the aux sends on the console DIRECTLY map to the mix outputs on the RM and main output of the console DIRECTLY maps to the main outputs of the RM.

Can we PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE have those network inputs on the RM made available on Dante...


If you're talking about the Stagebox modes being available via Dante, we have that planned. I don't have a date yet but we have it on the list for this year.

Stagebox mode would be one use, yes. But more importantly, with the correct placement in the signal path, a Dante receiver for each mix and main output would allow inserting external FX such as Waves XFBK on those outputs...

Karyn

-------------------------------------------------------
SL32ai, RM32ai, SL328AI x2, SL18sAI x2, all Dante.
Studio 192, Digimax FS, Faderport,
Sonar Platinum, Studio One.
http://refer.waves.com/dzDVn
Dante Level2 certified.
User avatar
by kinkybuddy on Tue Mar 21, 2017 4:13 pm
heres a quick way to GUARANTEE CORRECT SETUP WITH AVB and Mixers


https://youtu.be/NHcUm4FxD_Q
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by robranogajec on Mon Apr 17, 2017 8:43 pm
Ray. Any update on the Dante 96k question?
" I don't know if our Dante card solution can support 96kHz. I've asked Engineering to investigate the Audinate module implementation to get an answer."

Regards Rob.
User avatar
by gbam55 on Tue May 09, 2017 2:17 am
Hi all, this is a repost from the Rm enthusiast FB group to reach a wider audience, generate feedback and hopefully get some answers with features & dates :

Roadmap for RM & CS18 - could we give some info as to the future, please ?

"The stage box formfactor must have a future and whilst this may well be catered for in the SL series III recent posts suggest this won't before 4Q17 at the earliest.

In the mean time it would be well received by the current Rmxxai user community and me in particular, if we could have some concrete info on where we are going and also on where we cannot or don't want to go with this ecosystem.

I love the idea of the series III mixers but it does not work for me without a stagebox and then I would not need all the the I/O on the mixer but only on the stagebox with a card recorder on stage that goes way beyond the current 32gb limit (my 2012 MacBook accepts 128gb cards) I don't need high sample rates 44.1 & 48k are fine for my needs.

I'm looking at the CS18ai but I can't justify the investment without some hard dates on the future of the platform.

Btw, If Dante is the way to go for certain applications option let's have debate on the forum soon. Thanks

Btw2, cs18ai running the SL series 3 stagebox mixer recorder and there we have a solution for today and tomorrow."

Thanks

Presonus StudioLive 16.4.2, 16.0.2 (x2), Studiolive mobile, Mac mini i7 Quad core, 16GB, MacBook Pro 2012 (1T Ssd & with all the Ports you need) Studio One Professionnal. Mélodine editor, Fader Port, StudioLive RM32-AI, CS18-ai, KRK VTX4 monitors and KRK 10s.
KRK 10 3 monitors. Yamaha O1v, KRK rokit 10 3 monitors. RCF 725-II PA and RCF 325 stage monitors. Turbosound TQ425/455 DP PA.
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by wahlerstudios on Tue May 09, 2017 6:02 am
Thanks for letting the unknowing know what is "happening" in the big world out there... 3 stageboxes for the SL III are announced for Q3, the 2 others were supposed to follow until the end of the year. If you think of how often this time schedule and its content was changed already during the first five months of this year, there hardly will be any stageboxes by the end of this year, but probably we will see a "dummie". PreSonus is very good at least in this discipline. You still see a lot of "dummie photos" in their web site with features, that never came true...

The veterans here know that the best advice is to not trust any time schedule / release date published in Baton Rouge. It looks like the "ecosystem" will not be complete (available) within one year after the mixer's release, so if you need the stageboxes (like I would for concerts), there is nothing to buy. It's as simple as that.

If you have a RM/RML mixer, a CS 18 is a good choice. It makes the RM/RML family complete and brings back faders. Dante is an option, but then the CS lacks some of its features. Only an AVB network makes this "system" complete.

Do not expect/do not count on any further development of the AI family of mixers. We might see some little improvements still, e.g. the ones promised for the April update, but PreSonus did not deliver. If the RM/CS system works for you like it is now, I can only recommend it. I am really happy with it, especially the flexibilty of using two RM mixers in any combination with and without AVB. With two RM mixers in an AVB network you can also bring FireWire back to FOH.

I don't look back to my SL 2442AI any more...

SL16 | 32R | 16R | 16M

Apple routers | iPads | PreSonus SW5E & Motu AVB switches | Alesis iO Docks | Yamaha S112, S15e, S10e, SM12, SM10 | LD Systems Curv 500 | Galaxy Audio Hot Spots | Mac mini | Lenovo Laptop | Studio One Artist 4.5.4 & Pro 3.5.6
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by tourtelot on Tue May 09, 2017 7:44 am
"I don't look back to my SL 2442AI any more..."

Doug shakes his head and says "Presonus? Never again."

D.
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by Karyn on Tue May 09, 2017 10:01 am
For me the only thing missing is Dante returns on the aux and main outputs, and Ray has said he'll look into that.

AVB is a proprietary solution, despite the "open standard" propaganda. Yes, it links the RM to a CS, but that's as far as it'll ever go.

Karyn

-------------------------------------------------------
SL32ai, RM32ai, SL328AI x2, SL18sAI x2, all Dante.
Studio 192, Digimax FS, Faderport,
Sonar Platinum, Studio One.
http://refer.waves.com/dzDVn
Dante Level2 certified.
User avatar
by wahlerstudios on Wed May 10, 2017 5:29 am
"I don't look back to my SL 2442AI any more..."

Please, do not misunderstand me. I still love the simplicity of the SL AI consoles and their "space" for everything. I really miss the ease of use and the clear orientation. The CS is small, its surface is packed full and the multiple layers (not only the four main fader banks) can easily make the workflow unclear. You really have to watch out WHAT you are doing or intending to do and WHERE you are at the moment. I still need time to get used it. ;-)

I don't look back to the console any more because the RM/RM/CS combination is fully scalable and has an incredible flexibility, which I was missing more and more with the console and its fixed channel frame. I don't think I will ever use 64 channels, but expanding the system from 32 to 64 channels (or FOH and stagebox) means just one 4U rack more.

For me the RM/RM/CS combination works fine and I can live with it also without any further updates and developments. This thread was about "Upcoming updates (AVB Recording, MIDI, Smaart)". I think we should stop this thread now, because PreSonus is not happy with it.

SL16 | 32R | 16R | 16M

Apple routers | iPads | PreSonus SW5E & Motu AVB switches | Alesis iO Docks | Yamaha S112, S15e, S10e, SM12, SM10 | LD Systems Curv 500 | Galaxy Audio Hot Spots | Mac mini | Lenovo Laptop | Studio One Artist 4.5.4 & Pro 3.5.6
User avatar
by gbam55 on Wed May 10, 2017 6:36 am
Hi Wahlerstudios, I appreciate and agree with most of your last post except the last remark.

It is precisely because we want answers that this thread exists - That Presonus has some priority and positioning issues is their commercial concern.

If they like I would sign a NDA to know the real truth and what's planned and what's not just to know what investment I should make next.

The stage box mixer is the future with and without controllers and mixers. Just take a look out there and see the competition. Start talking 64 Channels and the competition starts to thin out. Talk higher sample rates 88/96 and it disappears at this price point. So even with some limitations on the announced functionality this product (RM) has it's place in the market... and some.

It takes management decision and courage to tell it as it is. Now Presonus, please don't disappoint on this point.

Thanks

Presonus StudioLive 16.4.2, 16.0.2 (x2), Studiolive mobile, Mac mini i7 Quad core, 16GB, MacBook Pro 2012 (1T Ssd & with all the Ports you need) Studio One Professionnal. Mélodine editor, Fader Port, StudioLive RM32-AI, CS18-ai, KRK VTX4 monitors and KRK 10s.
KRK 10 3 monitors. Yamaha O1v, KRK rokit 10 3 monitors. RCF 725-II PA and RCF 325 stage monitors. Turbosound TQ425/455 DP PA.
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by tourtelot on Wed May 10, 2017 8:56 am
Presonus is not happy with it??? Maybe better if they took these comments as a learning experience as to WHY their customers aren't happy with them. That is customer service. The other, arrogance, of which there is already plenty to go around.

So instead, just to keep Presonus happy, I am going to step away from these forums just as I am stepping away from the brand itself. I started off simply trying to have a discussion about what I, as a multi-thousand dollar customer would like to see, and found a business model that is unsupportable. Very frustrating.

Bye bye.

Douglas Tourtelot
User avatar
by gbam55 on Wed May 10, 2017 9:00 am
Hi Tourtelot, just hang around for a while longer to see if Presonus chime in with an update ?

Presonus StudioLive 16.4.2, 16.0.2 (x2), Studiolive mobile, Mac mini i7 Quad core, 16GB, MacBook Pro 2012 (1T Ssd & with all the Ports you need) Studio One Professionnal. Mélodine editor, Fader Port, StudioLive RM32-AI, CS18-ai, KRK VTX4 monitors and KRK 10s.
KRK 10 3 monitors. Yamaha O1v, KRK rokit 10 3 monitors. RCF 725-II PA and RCF 325 stage monitors. Turbosound TQ425/455 DP PA.

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