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OK, I have a Piano Melody (treble clef) and chord part (treble/bass clef) in two separate MIDI files.
I have tried various things but cannot see an easy way to get Notion to:

1. Import the files and put them onto suitable clefs without hundreds of ledger lines
2. Play the song back using a piano sound
3. Print the sheet music so that a Pianist can easily make sense of it

It's the first time I have tried to use Notion but it seems very unintuitive to me.
I even tried exporting from Studio One Pro to Notion but the results didn't look right and eventually Studio One crashed due to conflicts between Notion and itself over sharing my audio interface (Steinberg U242).

Can anyone please give me some pointers as I cannot find any YouTube videos doing what I want to do? Thanks in advance. Of course any videos I found the user was able to get things working like a dream and were Mac based :roll:

Afterglow
Windows 7 Home X64 SP1, Intel Core i5-3570K @ 3.4Ghz, 16 Gb RAM (DDR3-1600), Steinberg UR242 Audio I/F with Yamaha v1.9.10 ASIO drivers
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by Surf.Whammy on Mon Jul 24, 2017 7:21 pm
AfterGlow wroteOK, I have a Piano Melody (treble clef) and chord part (treble/bass clef) in two separate MIDI files.

1. Import the files and put them onto suitable clefs without hundreds of ledger lines
2. Play the song back using a piano sound
3. Print the sheet music so that a Pianist can easily make sense of it



IMPORTANT THINGS TO UNDERSTAND

(1) The first thing to understand is that each time you import a MIDI file (*.mid), NOTION creates a new score based on the contents of the MIDI file . . .

(2) The second thing to understand is that initially the imported MIDI will be shown in sequencer style as a "piano roll", where you will not see music notation but instead will see horizontal bars that represent notes . . .

So, you need to convert the "piano roll" to music notation; and there is a menu item for doing this . . .

[NOTE: Sometimes, the MIDI is converted to music notation immediately, so it depends; but if it starts out in "piano roll" format, then you just need to use the "Convert to Notation" menu item on the Tools menu . . . ]

(3) The third thing you need to know is that there is not a one-to-one mapping of MIDI to music notation . . .

Converting MIDI to music notation is more of an art than a science; and the results will vary depending on the complexity of the music; but if the music is relatively simple, the music notation will match it more precisely . . .

This is not unique to NOTION . . .

There is not a one-to-one mapping of MIDI to music notation; and it applies to every application that converts MIDI to music notation . . .

MIDI uses different units of time from music notation units of time; so determining how to best map MIDI time units to music notation time units is determined by algorithms that by definition are imprecise and consequently have to make judgements based on what is mostly likely to be the best match . . .

For some MIDI notes, there is a one-to-one mapping for time units; but not always, since MIDI time units have a different granularity, which basically maps to higher precision in MIDI time units than in music notation time units, which is one way to explain the different granularities . . .

Unless you use triplets and so forth in music notation, everything is based on multiples of two (whole note, half note, quarter note, eighth note, sixteenth note, and so forth). This is not the case with MIDI time units . . .

MIDI uses Parts Per Quarter (PPQ), but Digital Audio Workstation (DAW) applications, Reason (Propellerhead Software), and NOTION use 960 ticks per quarter note. A sixteenth note is 240 ticks, which is great; but what happens if the duration of a MIDI note is 247 ticks?

[NOTE: You can specify different granularities for PPQ, but in DAW applications, Reason, and NOTION, there always are 960 ticks per quarter note; so these are two very different units. PPQ is MIDI; but it's also colloquially called "ticks" in the MIDI universe, except this is a different usage of "tick". If the PPQ is 480, then there are 480 "ticks" per quarter note in the MIDI universe; but that's not the way DAW applications, Reason, and NOTION define and use their ticks per quarter note, which always is 960 ticks per quarter note. If the PPQ is 960, then a "tick" is a tick, which in some respects make this more difficult to understand than the quantum mechanics of black holes . . . :P ]

Do you round 247 ticks down to a sixteenth note, or might it be part of a complex tuplet where 5 notes are played in the time that would be for three notes, or whatever?

And what about the time signature and tempo?

This is where the "art" aspect of converting MIDI to music notation comes into play; and when the ticks vary by tiny amounts, the conversion algorithms have to make "best guesses", which is all they can do, since 247 ticks is not exactly anything in music notation time units. Nevertheless, it's nearer to a sixteenth note . . .

Where it really starts getting complex is when you factor the tempo measured in beats per minute . . .

The standard is 4/4 time, where a quarter note is one beat; so when the tempo is 200 beats per minute, you need to divide each beat by 960 to get the duration of a tick, since there always are 960 ticks per quarter note in 4/4 time; but what about 5/4 time?

Do you divide (4 times 960) by 5 to get the ticks per quarter note in 5/4 time?

No, you don't do it this way . . .

A quarter note always is 960 ticks regardless of the time signature and tempo . . .

What this tells you is that a tick is not an absolute value . . .

The duration in milliseconds of a tick depends on the tempo; but in MIDI (a) it's microseconds and (b) the PPQ might not be 960, which makes it all the more confusing, except that a microsecond is one-thousandth of a millisecond; so it's not so bad, really--just more arithmetic . . .

Timing in MIDI (Christopher Dobrian, University of California, Irvine)

If the time signature is 4/4 and the tempo is 200 beats per minute (60 seconds), then there are 200 quarter notes per minute (MIDI, DAW applications, Reason, and NOTION) . . .

If the time signature is 5/4 and the temp is 200 beats per minute (60 seconds), then there are 200 quarter notes per minute, but there are fewer measures, because in 5/4 time there are 5 beats per measure; so you have 40 measures rather than the 50 measures in 4/4 time . . .

Code: Select all
(50 times 4) = (40 times 5) = 200 


Code: Select all
In 4/4 time at 200 beats per minute, where a quarter note is 1 beat,  this is the arithmetic: 

60 seconds / 200 beats = 0.3 seconds per beat = 300 milliseconds per beat

300 milliseconds / 960 ticks per beat = 1 tick per 0.3125 milliseconds

240 ticks per sixteenth note = 75 milliseconds per sixteenth note in 4/4 time at 200 beats per minute

What do you do when the MIDI note duration is 247 ticks in 4/4 time at 200 beats per minute?

Do you map it to a sixteenth note?

If you map it to a sixteenth note, what happens to the 7 ticks you tossed?

If the PP! in the MIDI file is 480, to you normalize it to 960, so "ticks" equal ticks?


There are things you can do to improve the conversion of MIDI to music notation; and one of them is quantizing the MIDI, which is a process that examines the MIDI and tries to make the note durations consistent within ranges, where for example if there are two 1/8th notes but one is a tiny bit longer in duration than the other, quantizing will make them have equal durations for what 1/8th notes should be . . .

Quantizing can remove some of the "feel"; but the result works better for converting to music notation; and once you have the music notation, the musician can adjust the "feel", which is what musicians do when playing from sheet music . . .

Use the "Quantize to Notation" menu item on the Tools menu to quantize . . .

STEPS TO DO WHAT YOU WANT TO DO

These are the steps:

(1.1) Import the MIDI file for the melody; convert it to music notation if it is not already music notation; and quantize to notation . . .

(1.2) Save the score . . .

EXPECTED RESULT: You have the melody in a NOTION score, and it is assigned to a Piano . . .

(2.1) Import the MIDI file for the chords; convert it to music notation of it is not already music notation; and quantize to notation . . .

(2.2) if the chords are not on a grand staff, then switch to Score Setup and select the Grand Staff option, which is the "Notation" tab when you click on the "gear" icon at the left of the staff . . .

[NOTE: This step might not be necessary, but it depends on the information in the MIDI file for the chords. It's possible that the notes will not be separated to treble clef and bass clef; but it depends on the information in the MIDI file. If the notes are not separated to treble and bass clefs, there is a way to cause this to happen; but that's another exercise . . . ]

(2.3) Save the score . . .

EXPECTED RESULT: You have the chords in a NOTION score; and it is assigned to a Piano . . .

(3) Open the chord score and save it with a different name . . .

EXPECTED RESULT: Now you have a copy of the chord score; it is open in NOTION; and it has a different name . . .

(4.1) Open the melody score; and select all the measures and notes, which you can do with a menu item on the "Edit" menu . . .

(4.2) Copy the measures and notes you selected in the previous step (4.1) . . .

EXPECTED RESULT: You have copied all the melody measures and notes to the Clipboard . . .

(5.1) Switch to the chord score . . .

(5.2) Position the location point on the first beat of the first measure on the Piano staff where the chord notes are shown . . .

(5.3) Using "Paste Special" and "Voice 2", paste the notes in the Clipboard to the Piano staff with the chords . . .

[NOTE: You will find "Paste Special" on the Edit menu; and it has a fly-out submenu, where you will select "Paste into Voice 2" . . . ]

EXPECTED RESULT: You have the melody notes and chords on the same treble staff, but the melody notes are Voice 2, while the chords are Voice 1 . . .

(6) If you want to see the melody notes and chord notes colorized by voice, there is a menu item on the View menu that does this. It's called "Show Voice Colors" . . .

(7) Save the score that now has the melody and chords on a single Grand Staff . . .

(8) You can play the score and hear it played using the NOTION Piano; and you can print the score to produce sheet music . . .

THOUGHTS

If you want a separate set of sheet music for the melody and a separate set of sheet music for the chords; then don't paste the melody to the Grand Staff with the chords . . .

Instead, you have a separate score for the melody and a separate score for the chords; so you can print them separately . . .

This should be enough information to enable you to make progress . . .

There are other things you can do; but you will learn them over time, and it's too much to explain in a post . . .

Start reading the NOTION 6 User Guide and doing some experimenting . . .

NOTION is very powerful; and overall it's as easy to use as possible . . .

This following YouTube video is an example of some of the advanced things you can do with NOTION, where in this YouTube video, Digital Performer 9 (MOTU) is the Digital Audio Workstation (DAW) application and ReWire host controller; and both NOTION 6 and Reason 9 (Propellerhead Software) are ReWire slaves . . .

I used NOTION to add instruments to the song, which is a demo song by the Techno Squirrels that came with Reason 6 . . .

Some of the staves in the NOTION project are playing virtual instruments in Reason, but other staves in the NOTION file are playing VSTi virtual instruments; and the two NOTION External MIDI staves in the NOTION score are playing four virtual instruments hosted in the DAW application (MachFive 3 [MOTU], SampleTank 3 [IK Multimedia], and two instances of Twin 2 [FabFilter Software Instruments]). All the audio is handled by the DAW application. The audio generated by NOTION and Reason is sent to the DAW application (Digital Performer 9) which renders the audio and controls it in the Digital Performer 9 mixing board, which is what the ReWire host controller does in a ReWire session . . .

I used NOTION to add a horn section (baritone saxophone and sassy Cuban trumpet); Hammond B-3 organ; Jazz Bass; some synthesizers; and some other stuff; but there are additional added instruments hosted in the DAW application . . .

This is at the upper limit of what the 2.8-GHz Mac Pro (Early 2008) with 32 GB of system memory can handle; so the audio skips at a few times, because I also was running ScreenFlow (Telestream) to capture the display and audio; and it's just too much computing, even though the Mac Pro is a supercomputer . . .

When I do all this stuff for a song, I do it in steps and layers; but for the YouTube video, the goal was to show all of it at once and to prove that all of can be done at once, simultaneously in real-time . . .

With a newer and faster Mac Pro, it would be perfect; but so what . . .

[NOTE: There is no voice-over for the YouTube video; and the first 30 seconds shows the "About" screens for the three applications. Then the music starts . . . ]

phpBB [video]


Lots of FUN! :)

The Surf Whammys

Sinkhorn's Dilemma: Every paradox has at least one non-trivial solution!
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by AfterGlow on Tue Jul 25, 2017 3:03 am
Thanks for the detailed reply. I will work my way through it and let you know how I get on :thumbup:

Before seeing your reply I did some initial experimenting and my main gripe was that Notion continued to display low notes using lots of ledger lines even though I had the split point set correctly and had told it to use a Treble and Bass clef for this track. I actually got better results with very little effort using this free utility...

http://midisheetmusic.sourceforge.net/

but the output options are very limited so I am persevering with Notion.

Thanks again,

Afterglow
Windows 7 Home X64 SP1, Intel Core i5-3570K @ 3.4Ghz, 16 Gb RAM (DDR3-1600), Steinberg UR242 Audio I/F with Yamaha v1.9.10 ASIO drivers
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by AfterGlow on Tue Jul 25, 2017 11:14 am
Ok, I'm stuck at...

(1.2) Save the score . . .


The option is ghosted out which I assume is because it's the demo version of Notion.
So Presonus want me to pay for it without being able to test it properly. :thumbdown:

Thanks for your help anyway.

Afterglow
Windows 7 Home X64 SP1, Intel Core i5-3570K @ 3.4Ghz, 16 Gb RAM (DDR3-1600), Steinberg UR242 Audio I/F with Yamaha v1.9.10 ASIO drivers
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by Surf.Whammy on Tue Jul 25, 2017 6:56 pm
AfterGlow wroteOk, I'm stuck at...
(1.2) Save the score . . .

The option is ghosted out which I assume is because it's the demo version of Notion.


Do what I did . . .

(1) Buy a lawnmower

(2) Buy a gas can

(3) Get some gas

Start your own business . . .

Lots of FUN! :+1

The Surf Whammys

Sinkhorn's Dilemma: Every paradox has at least one non-trivial solution!
User avatar
by jonnylipsham on Wed Jul 26, 2017 11:02 am
AfterGlow wroteOK, I have a Piano Melody (treble clef) and chord part (treble/bass clef) in two separate MIDI files.
I have tried various things but cannot see an easy way to get Notion to:

1. Import the files and put them onto suitable clefs without hundreds of ledger lines
2. Play the song back using a piano sound
3. Print the sheet music so that a Pianist can easily make sense of it

It's the first time I have tried to use Notion but it seems very unintuitive to me.
I even tried exporting from Studio One Pro to Notion but the results didn't look right and eventually Studio One crashed due to conflicts between Notion and itself over sharing my audio interface (Steinberg U242).

Can anyone please give me some pointers as I cannot find any YouTube videos doing what I want to do? Thanks in advance. Of course any videos I found the user was able to get things working like a dream and were Mac based :roll:



If you are on Facebook, I would highly recommend joining the Notion group. If you do that, I would also recommend reaching out to one Derek Jones. He is a Notion genius. He'll get you straightened out.

Scan Computers UK 3XS Audio PC
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Yamaha QS300 Worskstation (c.1994!)

http://www.jonnylipshamstudios.co.uk
http://www.nimbitmusic.com/jonnylipsham
http://www.lipshamandgeib.com
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by AfterGlow on Wed Jul 26, 2017 3:43 pm
Thanks for the tip, jonny

Afterglow
Windows 7 Home X64 SP1, Intel Core i5-3570K @ 3.4Ghz, 16 Gb RAM (DDR3-1600), Steinberg UR242 Audio I/F with Yamaha v1.9.10 ASIO drivers
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by jamalbee on Thu Aug 24, 2017 10:08 pm
Hi Surf.Whammy,

Surprisingly, I tried to apply your method on an imported midi file (piano part made in Logic), but I'm stuck at step one...the convert to notation option is greyed out and there is no way I can activate it. Any advice ?
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by Surf.Whammy on Fri Aug 25, 2017 2:47 am
jamalbee wroteHi Surf.Whammy,

Surprisingly, I tried to apply your method on an imported midi file (piano part made in Logic), but I'm stuck at step one...the convert to notation option is greyed out and there is no way I can activate it. Any advice ?


(1) What version of NOTION are you using?

(2) Is the imported MIDI in piano roll format or is it already converted to music notation?

(3) Did you begin by selecting the staves you imported?

(4) Have you saved the score?

THOUGHTS

Nothing else comes to mind at the moment . . .

More information will be helpful . . .

:)

The Surf Whammys

Sinkhorn's Dilemma: Every paradox has at least one non-trivial solution!
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by jamalbee on Fri Aug 25, 2017 9:19 am
1. I use Notion 6
2. The file is in piano roll format
3. I selected the imported staves
4. I haven't yet saved the file.

On second thoughts, I suspect a corrupted file or a bad export from Logic. I tried with another file and got no problem.

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