OK, here's my latest entry in the "nearly naked Notion" category. This is an original composition for chamber orchestra, based on an English folk tune collected by Ralph Vaughan Williams in 1904, "The Lost Lady Found". This is a different version of the folk tune than the one used by Grainger in his Lincolnshire Posy, and so I took a bit of liberty with the title of the song to bring it a bit more current and make it more mysterious. I thought I'd try my hand at arranging and orchestrating in a similar vein to my favorite composers of the late romantic/early modern period.
This recording is pure Notion, using all Notion instruments and even Notion's OOTB reverb, with no other plug-ins or effects. The only exception is the solo cello, which is Vienna Instruments. Notion's solo cello is so terrible I couldn't stand listening to it exposed. Feedback is certainly welcome, as much since I don't often attempt my own arrangements and orchestrations than for any other reason. I had a great time with this one, but input is always appreciated. Next I'll record this using VSL all the way and post for any interested in hearing the difference. Enjoy! Michael phpBB [audio]
iMac (Retina 5K 27", 2019) 3.6 ghz I9 8-core 64 gb RAM Fusion Drive
with small AOC monitor for additional display macOS Sonoma 14.4 2 - 500 gb + 2 - 1 tb external SSD for sample libraries M Audio AirHub audio interface Nektar Panorama P1 control surface Nektar Impact 49-key MIDI keyboard Focal CMS40 near-field monitors JBL LSR310S subwoofer Notion 6/Notion Mobile + Studio One 6 Pro http://www.tensivity.com |
Here's the strings sub-mix for this piece, recorded with VSL Dimension Strings, and VSL Solo Cello. Let me know what you think!
Michael phpBB [audio]
iMac (Retina 5K 27", 2019) 3.6 ghz I9 8-core 64 gb RAM Fusion Drive
with small AOC monitor for additional display macOS Sonoma 14.4 2 - 500 gb + 2 - 1 tb external SSD for sample libraries M Audio AirHub audio interface Nektar Panorama P1 control surface Nektar Impact 49-key MIDI keyboard Focal CMS40 near-field monitors JBL LSR310S subwoofer Notion 6/Notion Mobile + Studio One 6 Pro http://www.tensivity.com |
Here's the first cut of the final version, recorded with VSL instruments, driven from the Notion score to Notion audio output directly from the Vienna Ensemble players (there are 7 VE instances playing simultaneously in this recording).
phpBB [audio] Interesting to compare it with the Notion version. I made a few compositional changes, very minor (transposed a few voices, reinforced a few parts here and there). Michael
iMac (Retina 5K 27", 2019) 3.6 ghz I9 8-core 64 gb RAM Fusion Drive
with small AOC monitor for additional display macOS Sonoma 14.4 2 - 500 gb + 2 - 1 tb external SSD for sample libraries M Audio AirHub audio interface Nektar Panorama P1 control surface Nektar Impact 49-key MIDI keyboard Focal CMS40 near-field monitors JBL LSR310S subwoofer Notion 6/Notion Mobile + Studio One 6 Pro http://www.tensivity.com |
You Notion-ites do some really, really great work.
Having said that, as someone who had not always listened to classical music or similar styles very much it often seems to be missing the depth of acoustic recordings of string or orchestral players, etc, etc. I suppose that's a dillema of sorts with all sample based music but it seems to be more of an issue with orchestral than pop where in the former the acoustics of the room (or hall asit were) seems to play a large part in it. I often listen to some of this and wonder what some of it might sound like re-amped, played through good monitors and mic'ed in a room. As to "nearly naked Notion", let's put some undies on it, being a family friendly forum and all... |
I think the main problem (for me, anyway) with the Notion samples is that they're close mic'd, which means that there's no real reverb. All reverb has to be applied artificially.
I suppose close mic'd samples have their advantages, but I like how effortless it is to get a good sound with my EastWest Quantum Leap SO samples with the natural reverb. Did this in Notion with EWQL samples without any additional tweaking or effects: phpBB [audio] This is a version with Notion 5 samples and Notion reverb: phpBB [audio] Needless to say, it sounds like a complete joke in comparison |
Lawrence wroteI suppose that's a dillema of sorts with all sample based music but it seems to be more of an issue with orchestral than pop where in the former the acoustics of the room (or hall asit were) seems to play a large part in it. Lawrence, for me that's been my main struggle with trying to reproduce orchestral music with samples over the last few years. I use VSL for most of my recording work, and I find that the dry approach they take to room acoustics is preferable (maybe since that's what I'm invested in) because I can adjust the reverb to any room I want. But as Janiukkonen said, that comes with a price - that of having to also learn to perfect the simulation of room-based, through-the-air music. It's the central challenge in my mind. I rely on VSL MIRpro and MIRx to help me with that, but I still struggle with the same thing that you do; creating warmth and resonance of human performances using synthetic means. Maybe what I'm trying to achieve is somewhat of a "holy grail" and will never be found, but I enjoy the trying...
iMac (Retina 5K 27", 2019) 3.6 ghz I9 8-core 64 gb RAM Fusion Drive
with small AOC monitor for additional display macOS Sonoma 14.4 2 - 500 gb + 2 - 1 tb external SSD for sample libraries M Audio AirHub audio interface Nektar Panorama P1 control surface Nektar Impact 49-key MIDI keyboard Focal CMS40 near-field monitors JBL LSR310S subwoofer Notion 6/Notion Mobile + Studio One 6 Pro http://www.tensivity.com |
Yes. Some people get really close but it still usually falls short sound wise but no composer cranking out 2-3 scores a month will be hiring studio rooms and engineers and all that unless he has a lot of spare cash. in that regard, samplers are a god send, no doubt.
Anyway, here's an example of something that I think sounds great (not samplers, live recording, and not my work (I wish). It's an abrdiged version of "Mr Holland's Opus", http://www.3daudioinc.com/clips/0803sydney.mp3 Here's a sketch of the tracking layout from the recording / mix engineer, Lynn Fuston. http://www.3daudioinc.com/3db/attachmen ... 1205780474 |
A few entries for the "3N" list, though I use Valhalla for almost all my reverb:
This one's all Notion. phpBB [audio] Mostly Notion, except for a couple of cheap (free? Can't remember) Kontakt trumpets. phpBB [audio] phpBB [audio] Obviously the accordion, vox, charangos, and flute FX aren't Notion, but everything else is. phpBB [audio] All Notion, other than the choirs, phpBB [audio] phpBB [audio] I'm not sure I agree with some of the assessments about the sound of Notion's libraries. VSL is just as thin if you don't pour on a bit of EQ and a good verb (even better if you get your early reflections set well). EWQL is fine, but it corners you into that thick, bass heavy Hollywood sound - which is great if that's what you're looking for, but it makes it more difficult to get an intimate, non-epic sound. I think with a decent verb, judicious EQing (which I rarely ever use on Notion - I should probably do more), and a lightly set compression (again, rarely used), one can get a more than respectable sound. Will it sound like 8Dio's Grand Adagio Strings? No, but then just a full complement of 8Dio strings costs at least 4 times what Notion costs and you don't get a beautifully easy to use UI to notate in, either.. . Kurt |
Kurt, great work! Very impressive...
iMac (Retina 5K 27", 2019) 3.6 ghz I9 8-core 64 gb RAM Fusion Drive
with small AOC monitor for additional display macOS Sonoma 14.4 2 - 500 gb + 2 - 1 tb external SSD for sample libraries M Audio AirHub audio interface Nektar Panorama P1 control surface Nektar Impact 49-key MIDI keyboard Focal CMS40 near-field monitors JBL LSR310S subwoofer Notion 6/Notion Mobile + Studio One 6 Pro http://www.tensivity.com |
Kurt, your examples are great!
I agree that Notions sounds can be used to get very realistic results if used well and that the most important thing with Notion is the interface (I have got loads of VSL samples and in the end I rarely use it then cause using the Notion sounds is just sooo easy). You really inspired me to try to do more with the sounds. Additionally, by hearing what you have done I got to notice just how few of the colors available in Notion i am use! All the best, Cesare |
kmlandre wrotemichaelmyers1 wroteKurt, great work! Very impressive... I fully support the idea of having a permanent platform (why not here, within this forum?) where people can post renderings and exchange ideas on how to make the best out of Notion sounds and the program. This might possibly evolve to a collective endeavor to create a set of Practical Recommendations (to be continually discussed and revised) to make the most out of Notion and its bundled sounds, concentrating possibly on issues like ⦁ guidelines for best settings of in-built EQ, reverb, etc for single instruments, or appropriate groups of instruments in busses, under various circumstances, ⦁ practical tips, perhaps specific to each instrument, to make the articulations work better, ⦁ free or low-cost external resources to remedy acknowledged specific deficits or weak points of Notion (which actually also translates to well-thought-of feature requests from Presonus). Congratulations, by the way, for the excellent and encouraging works above, using Notion's resources. Reha |
rehaartan wroteI fully support the idea of having a permanent platform (why not here, within this forum?) where people can post renderings and exchange ideas on how to make the best out of Notion sounds and the program. Done! Please see this post: https://forums.presonus.com/viewtopic.php?p=80887#p80887 By the way, Lawrence, had to steal your pic from earlier in this thread for the Group Icon - just too good to pass up! This might possibly evolve to a collective endeavor to create a set of Practical Recommendations...to make the most out of Notion... Also an excellent idea. I've been meaning to do something like that, but I've just been to busy (read: "lazy"). Now I have a reason to stop delaying (read "raise my posterior from it's preferred prone position")... Congratulations, by the way, for the excellent and encouraging works above, using Notion's resources. Thanks much!
Last edited by kmlandre on Sun Dec 27, 2015 4:43 am, edited 2 times in total.
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cesaremagri wroteKurt, your examples are great! Thanks Cesare! You really inspired me to try to do more with the sounds. Additionally, by hearing what you have done I got to notice just how few of the colors available in Notion i am use! Very glad to hear that my work is inspiring *something*, at least! Usually, if anything, it just inspires people to flee... Kurt |
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