soupiraille wroteI have Studio One v5.2 and have activated the hidden registry key to enable the legacy PDC algorithm, and I have no problem. It's in the manual.

Ah ha.

soupiraille wroteI have Studio One v5.2 and have activated the hidden registry key to enable the legacy PDC algorithm, and I have no problem. It's in the manual.

Downloaded the 5.2 manual. Searched for "registry" and "legacy". No dice.

soupiraille wroteI have Studio One v5.2 and have activated the hidden registry key to enable the legacy PDC algorithm, and I have no problem. It's in the manual.

I don't see anything about a hidden registry key in the latest updated manual. I searched and only found.

"Automatic Plug-In Delay Compensation

Some plug-in effects inherently have some delay, or latency. It takes a certain amount of time for these plug-ins to process the audio routed to them, which means the resulting output audio is slightly delayed. This especially applies to dynamics processor plug-ins that feature a look-ahead function, such as the included Compressor.

In Studio One, this delay is managed with plug-in delay compensation through the entire audio path. There are no settings to manage, as this feature is completely automatic. The sync and timing of every Audio Channel in your Song are automatically maintained, no matter what processing is being used.

The current total plug-in delay time is displayed in the left-side Transport, below the current sample rate."

If you have more info on this it might help tracking down the problem. Care to share that info with us?

Ok that was a joke..

PreSonus did indeed change their PDC algorithm from version 5.1, but it didn't break entirely the sidechain time alignment.
If you take the example project whose link is in the first post, when you put Pipeline (i.e. the plugin having some reported delay) *before* the compressor, then time alignment is OK.

So things are partially broken. I have no doubt that PreSonus will repair this. 5.2.0 was a major release, next one will most likely be a maintenance release. That issue is too big to be ignored by PreSonus.

soupiraille wrotePreSonus did indeed change their PDC algorithm from version 5.1, but it didn't break entirely the sidechain time alignment.
If you take the example project whose link is in the first post, when you put Pipeline (i.e. the plugin having some reported delay) *before* the compressor, then time alignment is OK.

Right, so this is a more realistic scenario. You won't be able to align anything here by just putting "Latency 1" Plugin before the SC Comp and you can not move Latency 2 & 3 for obvious reasons. Notice also, that every Latency Dummy has influence on Sidechain Offsets, by turning it off and on again.

@stefanrauch1 I think your example brings it up in a realistic way, in a mixing scenario you can easily end up with a larger routing chain. And there a lot of plugins with higher latency out there (like soothe, linear phase eqs, etc) which could sum up to a higher plugin chain latency.
In my opinion this is massive issue, sidechaining is a core feature and not a nice to have. I'm working with S1 since v.1.2 so I know that they will fix this, but I'm just wondering why this essential thing of PDC didn't get an absolute high priority.
The good thing is, you can always install S1 in parallel to test new versions and you can go back to the previous one.

soupiraille wroteI have Studio One v5.2 and have activated the hidden registry key to enable the legacy PDC algorithm, and I have no problem. It's in the manual.

soupiraille wroteOk that was a joke..

Really funny wasting my time on that one.

PreAl wrote...Really funny wasting my time on that one.

Let's try to keep this thread focused on the issue at hand. Given it's importance, I want to keep the small talk down to a minimum. If you have a PDC experience to share here, then please do it. Otherwise, we're not looking for someone to take over the investigation, mkay?

PreAl wroteI have Studio One v5.2 and have activated the hidden registry key to enable the legacy PDC algorithm, and I have no problem. It's in the manual.

soupiraille wroteOk that was a joke..

PreAl wrote...Really funny wasting my time on that one.

roland1 wroteLet's try to keep this thread focused on the issue at hand. Given it's importance, I want to keep the small talk down to a minimum. If you have a PDC experience to share here, then please do it. Otherwise, we're not looking for someone to take over the investigation, mkay?

You could have left this alone, but you can't resist having a dig can you? Funny how you went for me (you just quoted me) and not the other bloke who pretended he had a solution for a "joke", everyone can see what's happened here.

The easiest way for the thread to keep focused is to stop playing forums admin and leave me alone and make my comment Mr Makey. I wasted 20 minutes on that "joke" that has actually thrown this thread off balance. I'm entitled to comment that happened here, at least others won't have their own time wasted now.. you are not my censor or the boss of me.

Now you don't need to answer this, but if you do don't be surprised that you've find out you've hijacked your own thread. I take no responsibility if you want to turn this into another futile bashing exercise.. don't you ever get bored of it?

Just to get a consensus on this issue: so the current thinking/solution is that open a new song in Studio One version 5.02 and then import data from the later 5.2 song file in order to ensure that the timing / sidechains work properly?

Now what about regression? We all know that you can't open a 5.2 file in earlier versions of S1. Does this somehow apply when using song data import from a more recent song as well?

I know I could try this for myself — and will likely have to for my current project — but I figure someone who has gone through this process may have some insights to share based upon their experience.

roland1 wroteWe all know that you can't open a 5.2 file in earlier versions of S1.

False. That restriction is only for major (paid) updates.

No registry editing necessary!

You can open a 5.2 file in 5.0.2 and go back and forth if you want.

robertgray3 wrote

roland1 wroteWe all know that you can't open a 5.2 file in earlier versions of S1.

False. That restriction is only for major (paid) updates.

No registry editing necessary!

You can open a 5.2 file in 5.0.2 and go back and forth if you want.

Oops. False indeed. I should have checked first. Now I have. I just opened up my current 5.2 file in 5.02, and it opened up without any hassles. That said, I imagine there may be some regression issues, such as the handling of articulations, etc., given the recent update. But if you're only dealing with .wav files, then I guess there shouldn't be a problem.

I think that concern was more a kneejerk assumption because it happens in other apps that I use. My graphics sofware, for instance, won't open files from point releases that are higher; I have to then ensure that all my machines are up do date.

robertgray3 wrote

roland1 wroteWe all know that you can't open a 5.2 file in earlier versions of S1.

False. That restriction is only for major (paid) updates.

No registry editing necessary!

You can open a 5.2 file in 5.0.2 and go back and forth if you want.

Thanks Robert- That could be really important for some people.
So 3.xxx to any other 3.xxx is OK. 4.xxx to any other 4.xxx....any 5.xxx to any 5.xxx -All are O.K.
If saving a file to a newer version of S1, recommend doing a "Save As", with a new file name,
so as to keep the original file in the original iteration of S1. That's because certain plugins can behave
a lot differently within different versions of S1 (Ampire especially, but not only that).

sirmonkey wroteThanks Robert- That could be really important for some people.
So 3.xxx to any other 3.xxx is OK. 4.xxx to any other 4.xxx....any 5.xxx to any 5.xxx -All are O.K.

And to add, normally you get informed by S1 if you save a song which is created by a previous version and which won't open with the previous version anymore.

Hello! Gregor just post some snake oil "fix" to our problem!
Here's link to his video



here is what happened if you try add more busses



It will work if you have only one sub-mix Bus in your project which is clearly not the case in any professional mixing session. For example, you have all your Bass tracks routed to a separate Bus, a couple of synths routed to another Bus etc. And all your tracks have separate side-chain compressors. Now put some latency inducing plugins on that Busses - your side-chains will be messed up. Now aply this new Gregor's trick - route GHOST side-chain trigger to a new Bus and then route that Bus to one of existing Busses with instruments. This will fix sidechain timings for all tracks routed to the same Bus while all other tracks routed to another Busses will still have messed up sidechains! Just tested in Studio One 5.2
HOWEVER - messing with it a little bit further triggers “something” under the hood and delay compensation on sidechains starts to work on other tracks too! Completely unpredictable...
So dear Presonus - rather then give us a half baked "workarounds" please fix this terrible issue asap. Thanks!

shallsoul wroteHello! Gregor just post some snake oil "fix" to our problem!

shallsoul wroteSo dear Presonus - rather then give us a half baked "workarounds" please fix this terrible issue asap. Thanks!

Snake oil fix?

Yes this needs fixing yesterday by developers, but in the meantime anything that can help from Presonus employees is welcome. Thankyou Gregor for your efforts and this workaround (btw he actually calls it a workaround in the video, not a fix).

shallsoul wroteHello! Gregor just post some snake oil "fix" to our problem!
Here's link to his video
[...]
HOWEVER - messing with it a little bit further triggers “something” under the hood and delay compensation on sidechains starts to work on other tracks too! Completely unpredictable...
So dear Presonus - rather then give us a half baked "workarounds" please fix this terrible issue asap. Thanks!

It would be cool if you could figure out what that "something" is. A lot of great discoveries in history were made by pure accident — but we needed them. I'll take this fix any way we can get it and take a workaround for now.

Obviously Gregor's solution is not going to help either those of us using a traditional routing arrangement or EDM producers whose lifeblood is pumping synths through reams of sidechaining.

Totlal rubbish that Gregor video. Sorry to correct you Gregor put your plain wrong. Saying it was always this way is untrue. I can't believe he would even come out with something like this. Is this Presonus way of avoiding the fact they made an epic distaster of a mistake by makeing everyone who reported it look stupid. I just tried this again with both midi and audio and like everyone has posted before this never existed in anything but 5.1 and 5.2 period.

Pic below of a test that took 10mins to set up using both midi and audio in V4. 116.3MS of delay on the buss and both sidechains are perfectly in time. Disgracefull on every level Presonus.