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Hi folks. I thought I'd move this out of the release notes so we can talk about and analyze this issue more seriously — and maybe learn a few work-arounds as we wait for an official fix.

Thanks already to Stefan for providing an easy to use file to test your own PDC issues. ( viewtopic.php?p=258992#p258992 )

I did a test today, first in Studio One 5.2 and then in Studio One 4.6.1. Same file (4.6 version) but two different PDC results. What you see in the image is 4.6.1 signals getting through in perfect sync, whereas in 5.2 there is a drastic delay that would be audible on any recorded material as flams.

[ P.S. Pro Tip: If you wanna get me banned from a thread, just write something dismissive. :D ]

PDC in 5.2 & 4.6.png
Last edited by roland1 on Sat Mar 13, 2021 4:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Studio One Pro (v5) on i7 7700 win10 PC w16GB RAM and a Mac Pro Tower (w/RME & Focusrite interfaces.)

I use S1 as an author/musician/multi-media artist.
My work includes the newly released: Clearing a Path to Joy (And finding contentment along the way) [AuroraSkyPublishing.com]
and my upcoming music video, Too Big To Fail, which introduces Citizen Based Social Planning — "the next step in the evolution of democracy." You know...typical everyday stuff. :)
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by garybowling on Fri Mar 12, 2021 3:38 pm
Yes, this is a serious issue. Thanks for putting a spotlight on it.

We need everyone that logs in to post a response to this, even if it's just a post that says "I agree," because we need to shine more light on it. Maybe that will get it taken more seriously to get this addressed.

Is there an issue we can upvote for this? I have looked but don't find one, but maybe I don't now how to search properly.

gabo

ASUS laptop (AMD 5900HX), 32G, 2x2TB SSD, Win11-64, RME UFX & BabyFace, Studio One Pro 6, Addictive Drums2, Izotope 10, Soothe2, Waves, many plugins, Melodyne Studio 5, all versions updated frequently

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by garyanderson5 on Fri Mar 12, 2021 5:29 pm
I reported this twice myself. First ticket was in january and the second was the day 5.2 was released. There is a thread cropped up on Facebook today with a lot of guys having the same problems and a few on gearslutz. Hopefully this gains some traction as this has gone on long enough now. Fingers crossed there all over it for the next point update.

For reference 5.1 and 5.2 have the PDC issue. V4 and V5.0.2 don't have the PDC issue.

Anyone who has this issue help out with a ticket please. Lets get S1 back to the great DAW we all came here for.

Thanks all :)

Windows Pro 11 23H2, 13900K, Z790 Aorus Master, 64GB 32x2 G.Skill Trident Z C30 RAM, 3X 2TB Samsung 980 PRO, RX6650XT GFX Card, Corsair RM1000X PSU, Studio One Latest Version & Older versions, Baby Face Pro FS. Nektar T6,
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by leonordmann on Fri Mar 12, 2021 10:12 pm
Getting the same result of a rythmic pattern in version 5.2
Couldn't open it in 4.6 though.

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Kingston m.2 ssd 1 TB

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Studio One 5.2.1.64495
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Arturia Microfreak
Behringer Deepmind 6
Korg Minilogue

Check out my Music (Psydub, Psychedelic Dance Music):
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by Janko Kezar on Sat Mar 13, 2021 2:58 am
Yes I can confirm this. I have the same issue here.

Also I reported another sidechain issue 2 days ago for 5.2. The native Compressor device- if you copied it to another track it used to retain the sidechain routing for the new and the original track. In 5.2 the original track with a sidechain Compressor loses the sidechain routing and you have to set it anew,. Its quite a workflow killer for me.For this one they confirmed the issue.


Hopefully these sidechain stuff will get fixed soon because 5.2 for any electronic stuff is unusable at the moment.

HP z230 i7/16gb , HP Elitebook 8470 i7/12gb ,Win 10, 64 bit, S1 3.3.1, 2.6.5 64bit Focusrite Saffire Pro 40, AllenHeath Qu-24, Steinberg UR22-mkII
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by gregghart on Sat Mar 13, 2021 6:40 am
Several people have already put tickets in and got a response that it is a known issue and being worked on. Not sure additional tickets will help. Hoping it gets fixed sooner than later. I like the features in 5.2 and don't want to have to go back to 5.02.

Win11, 12th Gen Intel Core i7-12700K (3.60 GHz), 32GB Ram. Focusrite Scarlett 8i6 3rd Gen. Native Instruments Komplete Kontrol S88 Mark 2, Native Instruments Komplete Kontrol S61 Mark 1, Presonus FaderPort 8.

https://www.midiboy.com

https://gregghart.bandcamp.com
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by patricemazmanian on Sat Mar 13, 2021 6:42 am
I also have quite a few problems with v5.2 and pro eq.
My tracks are no longer syncronized when the pro eq is in linear phase mode.

I tried everything bypass / on all plugs, Disable Pro Eq, reload Pro Eq ... By magic, I changed the buffer of my RME (from 128 to 32) boom, everything was ok! I can confirm that this method works 100% on my computer.

With v5.1x, the bug also existed, to solve it it was enough to bypass / on all plugs and everything was in sync.

PS : Test performed without sidechains

S1 pro 6 -Vienna Ensemble Pro - Melodyne - Notion 6 - Win10 - jBridge 1.65 - Motherboard ASUS Z87-K - i7 4770K 3.5Ghz, 32 Go RAM - GeForce GT 610 1024MB - Audio interface RME Hammerfall multiface II - Faderport - ADAT Interface Focusrite Scarlett OctoPre - EWQL hollywood-orchestra...
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by patricemazmanian on Sat Mar 13, 2021 6:52 am
Very strange, with the buffer at 32, bypass off/on all plugs works! My tracks are sync again

S1 pro 6 -Vienna Ensemble Pro - Melodyne - Notion 6 - Win10 - jBridge 1.65 - Motherboard ASUS Z87-K - i7 4770K 3.5Ghz, 32 Go RAM - GeForce GT 610 1024MB - Audio interface RME Hammerfall multiface II - Faderport - ADAT Interface Focusrite Scarlett OctoPre - EWQL hollywood-orchestra...
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by roland1 on Sat Mar 13, 2021 8:29 am
gregghart wroteSeveral people have already put tickets in and got a response that it is a known issue and being worked on. Not sure additional tickets will help. Hoping it gets fixed sooner than later. I like the features in 5.2 and don't want to have to go back to 5.02.


When things are out in the open, there's nowhere to hide — except in denial.

I didn't know about this issue until someone alerted me to it — I'd been working a lot in another app. and just assumed that it was business as usual in studio one. Apparently not. And I didn't see the issue listed in any release notes as in "Please be cautious with sidechaining etc., because the timing is broken in this release." (That'll be the day. :D )

This thread simply lets others know to watch out for this issue and maybe helps us to come up with some solutions / workarounds until it does get addressed. At least we know what we're dealing with and it's not a subjective, isolated issue.

Studio One Pro (v5) on i7 7700 win10 PC w16GB RAM and a Mac Pro Tower (w/RME & Focusrite interfaces.)

I use S1 as an author/musician/multi-media artist.
My work includes the newly released: Clearing a Path to Joy (And finding contentment along the way) [AuroraSkyPublishing.com]
and my upcoming music video, Too Big To Fail, which introduces Citizen Based Social Planning — "the next step in the evolution of democracy." You know...typical everyday stuff. :)
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by tomorrowstk on Sat Mar 13, 2021 9:27 am
Yep, PDC issue confirmed here. S1Pro 5.2 on macOS 10.15.6
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by stefanrauch1 on Sat Mar 13, 2021 9:40 am
patricemazmanian wroteVery strange, with the buffer at 32, bypass off/on all plugs works! My tracks are sync again


Will check this, but please be aware that changing your buffersize mid-project will change the timing of plugin automation.

phpBB [video]



EDIT:
tried it and can not confirm that PDC (in sidechains) works at 32 samples buffer size.

OS: Win10 x64 || Software: Studio One Pro [latest version]
Hardware: AMD Ryzen 9 3950X || Asus Prime X570-PRO || 64GB DDR4 RAM || Asus Dual-RTX2070S-A8G-EVO || UAD2 Octo & Duo PCIe
Peripherals: RME Fireface UFX II (+2x ADA8200) || Faderport Legacy || Atom || NI Komplete Kontrol A25
Audio Settings: 44,1/48kHz, 256 Samples, DP Off, 64 Bit
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by gregghart on Sat Mar 13, 2021 1:22 pm
roland1 wrote
gregghart wroteSeveral people have already put tickets in and got a response that it is a known issue and being worked on. Not sure additional tickets will help. Hoping it gets fixed sooner than later. I like the features in 5.2 and don't want to have to go back to 5.02.


When things are out in the open, there's nowhere to hide — except in denial.

I didn't know about this issue until someone alerted me to it — I'd been working a lot in another app. and just assumed that it was business as usual in studio one. Apparently not. And I didn't see the issue listed in any release notes as in "Please be cautious with sidechaining etc., because the timing is broken in this release." (That'll be the day. :D )

This thread simply lets others know to watch out for this issue and maybe helps us to come up with some solutions / workarounds until it does get addressed. At least we know what we're dealing with and it's not a subjective, isolated issue.


Oh, I know! Wasn't meaning to imply not posting in this thread. I've just seen so many posts on Facebook and even this forum where people said they got a reply back that it's a known issue.

Also, not discouraging people from putting tickets in. Just meant to imply that they know about the issue, so I'm not sure a new ticket will resolve it any faster. But who knows. Maybe. :)

Win11, 12th Gen Intel Core i7-12700K (3.60 GHz), 32GB Ram. Focusrite Scarlett 8i6 3rd Gen. Native Instruments Komplete Kontrol S88 Mark 2, Native Instruments Komplete Kontrol S61 Mark 1, Presonus FaderPort 8.

https://www.midiboy.com

https://gregghart.bandcamp.com
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by roland1 on Sat Mar 13, 2021 5:06 pm
Tickets = job creation. :D It's a win/win.

Studio One Pro (v5) on i7 7700 win10 PC w16GB RAM and a Mac Pro Tower (w/RME & Focusrite interfaces.)

I use S1 as an author/musician/multi-media artist.
My work includes the newly released: Clearing a Path to Joy (And finding contentment along the way) [AuroraSkyPublishing.com]
and my upcoming music video, Too Big To Fail, which introduces Citizen Based Social Planning — "the next step in the evolution of democracy." You know...typical everyday stuff. :)
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by robertgray3 on Sat Mar 13, 2021 8:04 pm
gregghart wroteJust meant to imply that they know about the issue, so I'm not sure a new ticket will resolve it any faster. But who knows. Maybe. :)


I’m with you in theory, but I think frequency/amount of tickets and posts is the only way they realistically have to judge how “big a deal” an issue really is. Remember, DAW developers don’t tend to use the software as frequently or to the same degree as the users. It’s just how it is, pretty much the same for every DAW I’ve ever followed. They simply may not realize that for many (I would imagine very many users) every mix has this feature on at least a dozen tracks.

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by Tom B on Sat Mar 13, 2021 10:11 pm
Confirmed the Plugin Delay Compensation issue on my system (S1 5.1.2) using Stefan's test.

Thanks to all for letting us know. I was about to use side-chain ducking on a drum track. The plugins I want to use have modest latency which would be audible because of this issue.

-Tom

Studio One Pro 6.0.1, Win10 Pro, StudioCat i7-12700K, 64GB, GTX1050, RME UFX (Firewire), UAD-2 & Native, Waves, Toontrack, Melodyne Studio
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by adami on Sun Mar 14, 2021 1:25 am
Thanks so much for alerting users to this. I was hoping to switch from Reaper to Sphere in the next week or so, but I guess that isn't going to happen!
What a shame! I was excited about it!

Presonus Sphere.

Studio PC: W10 pro 64, i7-2600k 3.4ghz, 16gb RAM, 3xEVO 250gb SSD Lexicon I-Onix U82s, U42s, Tascam US1641, Focusrite Scarlett 2i2

Utility Laptops x2 : W10 pro 64, EVO ssd etc.
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by roland1 on Sun Mar 14, 2021 7:19 am
patricemazmanian wroteVery strange, with the buffer at 32, bypass off/on all plugs works! My tracks are sync again


They may not be in sync but merely benefiting from the increased buffer speed which makes the signals appear more in sync. But as you know, in the real world, mixing occurs at high buffer/block settings — 1024 and up — where you would then begin to notice the PDC timing issue.

Unless that issue doesn't exist, which I'm hoping for soon. :)

Studio One Pro (v5) on i7 7700 win10 PC w16GB RAM and a Mac Pro Tower (w/RME & Focusrite interfaces.)

I use S1 as an author/musician/multi-media artist.
My work includes the newly released: Clearing a Path to Joy (And finding contentment along the way) [AuroraSkyPublishing.com]
and my upcoming music video, Too Big To Fail, which introduces Citizen Based Social Planning — "the next step in the evolution of democracy." You know...typical everyday stuff. :)
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by stefanrauch1 on Sun Mar 14, 2021 8:09 am
Anyone's guess is as good as mine, but what patricemazmanian might be experiencing, is a problem of plugin latency in general sometimes not being reported to Studio One or not being received by Studio One properly. When enabling/disabling plugins, you can sometimes see that the latency readout in the bottom field does not update accordingly*. Maybe that's a problem that goes away with low buffer sizes... the Sidechain Latency Compensation issue however does not seem to be affected by interface buffer size, at least in my experiments so far.


* I am aware of the fact, that the overall latency readout of a project is the culmination of all plugins on all tracks, groups, I/O's and returns. And depending on the position of a plugin in a song it might not affect the overall latency at all. So I should point out, that I also experienced the aforementioned behavior in an empty project while testing new plugins (especially when toggling on/off oversampling or lookahead, there is often the need to disable/enable the plugin before latency is addressed correctly).

OS: Win10 x64 || Software: Studio One Pro [latest version]
Hardware: AMD Ryzen 9 3950X || Asus Prime X570-PRO || 64GB DDR4 RAM || Asus Dual-RTX2070S-A8G-EVO || UAD2 Octo & Duo PCIe
Peripherals: RME Fireface UFX II (+2x ADA8200) || Faderport Legacy || Atom || NI Komplete Kontrol A25
Audio Settings: 44,1/48kHz, 256 Samples, DP Off, 64 Bit
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by soupiraille on Sun Mar 14, 2021 11:47 am
stefanrauch1 wroteSo I should point out, that I also experienced the aforementioned behavior in an empty project while testing new plugins (especially when toggling on/off oversampling or lookahead, there is often the need to disable/enable the plugin before latency is addressed correctly).

As far as I'm concerned, I have reported that issue and it was corrected in v5.1 ("Delay compensation / latency not updated unless the plugin is reset manually" in the changelog). The issue was even there in v4.

But mind you, it was not the case for every plugin, with some plugins the delay could be updated live without switching off and on the plugin; the issue had to do with the way the plugin's delay was reported to Studio One, some ways worked and other didn't.

AFAIC, you shouldn't have that issue anymore in v5.1+
Last edited by soupiraille on Sun Mar 14, 2021 9:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.


፨ Studio One Professional 5.2
፨ Windows 10 x64 (1709)
፨ Intel i9-7980XE
፨ 32 GB RAM
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by stefanrauch1 on Sun Mar 14, 2021 12:33 pm
Good to know, thank you!
So, as I'm stuck working in v5.02, I 'm screwed for now..
..but hey, another goodie to look forward to, when the audio engine will finally been taken care of :roll:

OS: Win10 x64 || Software: Studio One Pro [latest version]
Hardware: AMD Ryzen 9 3950X || Asus Prime X570-PRO || 64GB DDR4 RAM || Asus Dual-RTX2070S-A8G-EVO || UAD2 Octo & Duo PCIe
Peripherals: RME Fireface UFX II (+2x ADA8200) || Faderport Legacy || Atom || NI Komplete Kontrol A25
Audio Settings: 44,1/48kHz, 256 Samples, DP Off, 64 Bit

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