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[DAW v DAW - Part 2: Automation Speed]

(http://www.admiralbumblebee.com/music/2 ... io-one-450)

“Yes, it gets worse. Unsurprisingly it’s the reigning champion of sucking at automation: Studio One.
The normal 1600 sample (800 on both sides of transition) window was *way* too small. I had to render the entire file in a single image with a 57,600 window. In the large image, each block is 1,920 samples on the X-axis.
That’s a 15,360 sample fade. 48 samples is 1ms. 320ms fade when then visual feedback, and what I entered, is a sharp transition.” :shock:

iMac Late 2015
Intel Core i5 3,2 GHz
Memory: 24 GB
Graphics AMD Radeon R9 M390 VRAM (Total): 2048 MB
OS X 10.11.6 (15G1217)
Apollo Twin Thunderbolt
Studio One latest version
https://soundcloud.com/mytopia
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by Jose7822 on Sun May 26, 2019 4:52 pm
I just finished reading the other thread where automation noise issues with fade in/out was discovered by the same guy who wrote the above article. Towards the end of that thread, I was happy to hear that the automation noise problems were fixed in Studio One v.4.5. But now the same guy discovers another issue, now regarding automation timing.

Nooo! :-(

Gigabyte X99 Designare EX | Intel Core i7 6800K (OC'ed to 4 GHz) | 64GB of Corsair Dominator Platinum (3333 MHz) | EVGA GTX 1070 FTW | Corsair H115i Water Cooler | Be Quiet! Dark Power Pro 1200 Watt PSU | Windows 10 Pro 64 bit | Studio One v4.5 | Lynx Aurora (n) 8TB | UAD 2 Octo | UAD 2 Quad
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by Bbd on Sun May 26, 2019 6:03 pm
If the guy wants to contact Support about the issue then fine. Why post his thread here on the forum if you have not tested this for yourselves?
Do you find an issue with this on your system?

Bbd

Please add your specs to your SIGNATURE.
Search the STUDIO ONE 4 ONLINE MANUAL. Access your MY.PRESONUS account.
OVERVIEW of how to get your issue fixed or the steps to create a SUPPORT TICKET.
Needs to include: 1) One Sentence Description 2) Expected Results 3) Actual Results 4) Steps to Reproduce.


OS: Win 10 x64 Home, Studio One Pro 4.x, Notion 6, Series III 24, Studio 192, Haswell CPU: i7 4790k @ 4.4GHz, RAM: 16GB, Faderport 8/16, Central Station +, PreSonus Sceptre S6, Eris 3.5, ELAC Sub, ATOM
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by Jemusic on Sun May 26, 2019 8:29 pm
I ran the test in 4.5. This is broken in 4.5. The OP is correct it is nearly a 300 ms fade either side.

In 4.1.4 it was instantaneous for me going from max level to silence level. And only 1 mS coming back back up from silence to max level. It is around 1mS either side for Ableton Live 10 as well.

I am sure this is easily fixed similar to the automation noise.

Please add your specs to your SIGNATURE.
Search the STUDIO ONE 4 ONLINE MANUAL. Access your MY.PRESONUS account.
OVERVIEW of how to get your issue fixed or the steps to create a SUPPORT TICKET.
Needs to include: 1) One Sentence Description 2) Expected Results 3) Actual Results 4) Steps to Reproduce.



Specs i5-2500K 3.5 Ghz - 8 Gb RAM - Win 7 64 bit - ATI Radeon HD6900 Series - RME HDSP9632 - Midex 8 Midi interface - Faderport 8 and 2018- Atom Pad- iMac 2.5Ghz Core i5 - Sierra 10.12.6 - Focusrite Clarett 2 Pre & Scarlett 18i20. Studio One V4.5, Notion 6.5, Ableton Live 10, LaunchPad Pro
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by admiralbumblebee on Sun May 26, 2019 8:49 pm
Bbd wroteIf the guy wants to contact Support about the issue then fine. Why post his thread here on the forum if you have not tested this for yourselves?
Do you find an issue with this on your system?


Good day! I'm "the guy".

I stopped contacting Presonus support after repeated instances of the support personnel not understanding what I was reporting. Being given basic troubleshooting instructions in response to a mildly complex (and detailed) bug report is absurdly frustrating, Having it happen multiple times is a sign.

Presonus released the software in this state, so here we are. If they wish to have me test their software, then I would be more than happy to do so in a detailed and professional manner as I have when contacted by numerous other developers. I LOVE software testing and documentation.

Until then... I'll just have fun investigating software.

I always update content when I see bugs fixed as well. I also make an effort to note versions tested, provide reproduction instructions and urge people to not trust me (and do the work themselves). Hopefully these actions show that I'm trying to be fair as possible.

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by admiralbumblebee on Sun May 26, 2019 8:58 pm
Jose7822 wroteI just finished reading the other thread where automation noise issues with fade in/out was discovered by the same guy who wrote the above article. Towards the end of that thread, I was happy to hear that the automation noise problems were fixed in Studio One v.4.5. But now the same guy discovers another issue, now regarding automation timing.

Nooo! :-(


The next article coming on the topic isn't particularly flattering to S1 either... :( I don't plan it this way, and personally I have a bias towards S1 since it's what I do all of my drum editing in no matter what other DAW I'm using. It would be wonderful if I could just switch to it and not constantly be annoyed by these sonic deficiencies (or the lack of notation). I'm in the cheer camp. The sooner S1 is super awesome, the sooner my life becomes simpler. :punk:

I have a similar bias for Tracktion Waveform for similar reasons. I'm an unabashed fan of it, and it's also "failing" these tests. :(

If this particular issue fixed in a timely manner, I promise to make an update video specifically covering it. As always, I'll edit previous articles with updates as well. :thumbup:

If anyone feels that I can improve this content, Im always open to ideas and criticism. Fairness and accuracy are my #1 concerns.

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by robertgray3 on Mon May 27, 2019 12:48 am
Thanks for doing these tests admiralbumblebee. Pretty illuminating. Hope it gets addressed.

Mac OS X Mojave 10.14.4
Mac Pro (Late 2013)
3 GHz 8-Core Intel Xeon E5
32 GB 1066 MHz DDR3
Dual AMD FirePro D500 3072 MB
Quantum 2
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by Robert Johnson III on Mon May 27, 2019 1:14 am
robertgray3 wroteThanks for doing these tests admiralbumblebee. Pretty illuminating. Hope it gets addressed.


Indeed!

iMac Late 2015
Intel Core i5 3,2 GHz
Memory: 24 GB
Graphics AMD Radeon R9 M390 VRAM (Total): 2048 MB
OS X 10.11.6 (15G1217)
Apollo Twin Thunderbolt
Studio One latest version
https://soundcloud.com/mytopia
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by Jose7822 on Mon May 27, 2019 2:08 am
Admiralbumblebee,

I think you’re already doing a great job. Please keep doing what you’re doing!

To be honest, I’m finding this version of Studio One to be a bit buggy. So far I’ve only experienced one crash, which is not a big deal. Studio One almost never crashes on me. However, I’m now experiencing issues recording an audio part where there’s a tempo change right before the measure I start recording. The audio plays back at twice the speed (similar to what a Sample Rate mismatch sounds like). Also, my console faders keep shrinking for no reason, so I have to keep adjusting their size vertically. Lastly, I was having a weird behavior where Studio One would sort of lock up graphically when using the MIDI editor in Superior Drummer 3 while the project was playing back. It’s almost like I lose focus away from SD3, so I have to stop the project in order to regain it. IOW, I wouldn’t be surprised to read a not so flattering post about Studio One 4.5.

BTW, I know that this is not the place to report these bugs. I’ll report them directly to support when I get a chance to find out how to reproduce these reliably. But this, in MY experience, is the buggiest version of Studio One so far. That said, I’m sure Presonus will be able to get Studio One back to being its usual awesome self in no time. They always do :-).

Gigabyte X99 Designare EX | Intel Core i7 6800K (OC'ed to 4 GHz) | 64GB of Corsair Dominator Platinum (3333 MHz) | EVGA GTX 1070 FTW | Corsair H115i Water Cooler | Be Quiet! Dark Power Pro 1200 Watt PSU | Windows 10 Pro 64 bit | Studio One v4.5 | Lynx Aurora (n) 8TB | UAD 2 Octo | UAD 2 Quad
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by patricemazmanian on Mon May 27, 2019 2:29 am
Jose7822 wroteBTW, I know that this is not the place to report these bugs. I’ll report them directly to support when I get a chance to find out how to reproduce these reliably. But this, in MY experience, is the buggiest version of Studio One so far. That said, I’m sure Presonus will be able to get Studio One back to being its usual awesome self in no time. They always do :-).

I think it is important to report bugs in the forum, it can confirm and / or avoid them.
cordially

S1 pro 4.5 x64 - Melodyne - Notion 6 - Win8 - jBridge 1.65 - Motherboard ASUS Z87-K - i7 4770K 3.5Ghz, 16 Go RAM - GeForce GT 610 1024MB - Audio interface RME Hammerfall multiface II - Faderport - ADAT Interface Focusrite Scarlett OctoPre - MIDI Interface Motu MIDI Express 128

http://mazmusic.free.fr/
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by garyanderson5 on Mon May 27, 2019 2:43 am
Confirmed also. This is really bad the amount of data missing in the fade down and extra data added in the fade up makes automation usless. It's not even close to what you want it to do.

I hope they fix this one asap. back to 4.1.4 till they sort this mess out. :(

Windows 10 64-Bit, i7 6700k 4.5 GHz, Asus Z170-A,16GB RAM, 250GB Samsung 850 EVO SSD, Studio One 4 Professional 64-Bit, Steinberg UR44.
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by musicchamber on Mon May 27, 2019 3:04 am
admiralbumblebee wrote
Bbd wroteIf the guy wants to contact Support about the issue then fine. Why post his thread here on the forum if you have not tested this for yourselves?
Do you find an issue with this on your system?


Good day! I'm "the guy".

I stopped contacting Presonus support after repeated instances of the support personnel not understanding what I was reporting. Being given basic troubleshooting instructions in response to a mildly complex (and detailed) bug report is absurdly frustrating, Having it happen multiple times is a sign.

Presonus released the software in this state, so here we are. If they wish to have me test their software, then I would be more than happy to do so in a detailed and professional manner as I have when contacted by numerous other developers. I LOVE software testing and documentation.

Until then... I'll just have fun investigating software.

I always update content when I see bugs fixed as well. I also make an effort to note versions tested, provide reproduction instructions and urge people to not trust me (and do the work themselves). Hopefully these actions show that I'm trying to be fair as possible.


Thank you for all your time and hardwork doing the testing. I have had issue with Persons support in the past and not listening and testing what I have discovered, very sad tbh.

Keep up the great work, and lets hope Presonus starts reading some of these forum posts!

Best
Scott

Studio One Professional v4.5.1, Apple iMac Pro 14 core, 128gb memory, 4TB SSD. MacOS Mojave, Presonus 192, DP88, RC500, ADL600, Focusrite ISA430, TC4000 reverb, SPL Phonitor, Event Opal monitors. HD800s mastering reference headphones. Sequential Prophet 12, Korg Pa3x, Roland Fp7-F, MOTU midi express 128, Xkey air 37, Studiolive CS18, plus loads of microphones and plugins etc
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by lfo2k on Mon May 27, 2019 11:15 am
Does this apply only to rendered stems, or (also) to the normal playback?

Maybe it has absolutly nothing to do with this problem in this thread, but i remember having a volume automation on a heavy kickdrum from mute to instant "in", on the begin of the kickdrum, and i could hear clear that the kickdrum audible to late. Just like i would have a bad cutted sample.

Like if the automation was to late.
Last edited by lfo2k on Mon May 27, 2019 12:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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by jdurham on Mon May 27, 2019 11:27 am
Thanks to @admiralbumblebee for this info -- gotta say, this is very frustrating. I'm going to confirm this stuff today for myself if possible. If I confirm this, I can't trust the timing, I need frame-accurate time since I work with picture. Not happy about these automation issues (and the fade issue from the other thread). Good grief.
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by admiralbumblebee on Mon May 27, 2019 11:34 am
lfo2k wroteDoes this apply only to rendered stems, or (also) to the normal playback?

Maybe it has absolutly nothing to do with this problem in this thread, but i remember having a volume automation on a heavy kickdrum from mute to instant in on the begin of the kickdrum, and i could hear a clear that the kickdrum was not audible to late, so it did click on start. Just like i would have a bad cutted sample.

Like if the automation was to late.


It happens on on renders and playback.

This is a 4.5 only issue as far as I know. 4.1.x does not exhibit this behaviour.

I've tried to find a workaround, and I have been unable to find one. Even mute automation is affected (it triggers late).

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by roland1 on Mon May 27, 2019 12:21 pm
Thanks, Bumblebee.

You have found bugs in the software and in "the system" for reporting them.

Let's stop killing the messengers and start fixing this software and its official support service.

Not much use in having tech support if they're not technically qualified to help you—or perhaps it's just a lack of motivation in some who don't like their job anymore...

I won't be updating to 4.5 on my PC. I think this is the 4th time I've avoided an update until it was fixed by a subsequent update.
Last edited by roland1 on Mon May 27, 2019 12:26 pm, edited 2 times in total.

I use: Studio One "Bug" Pro v4.51 & v3.56 on an i7 7700 win10 PC w16GB RAM and on a Mac Pro Tower (Sierra) w/RME & Focusrite interfaces.

When not loitering here, I can be found at: http://RolandK.ca

Attention all shoppers: deception and commerce are old friends. Ask questions; don't just nod and agree as expected.
[Unless it's "On sale" with a warning to "Hurry. Act now!" so you can also get a "FREE" [whatever] — what an awesome deal!]
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by lfo2k on Mon May 27, 2019 12:22 pm
admiralbumblebee wrote
Bbd wroteI stopped contacting Presonus support after repeated instances of the support personnel not understanding what I was reporting. Being given basic troubleshooting instructions in response to a mildly complex (and detailed) bug report is absurdly frustrating, Having it happen multiple times is a sign.



I think support is not for that kind of very indeep problems. They can help for simple problems most people experience, but not for very techy stuff.
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by roland1 on Mon May 27, 2019 12:24 pm
So who is supposed to do the real techie stuff, us here on the forum?

lfo2k wrote
admiralbumblebee wrote
Bbd wroteI stopped contacting Presonus support after repeated instances of the support personnel not understanding what I was reporting. Being given basic troubleshooting instructions in response to a mildly complex (and detailed) bug report is absurdly frustrating, Having it happen multiple times is a sign.



I think support is not for that kind of very indeep problems. They can help for simple problems most people experience, but not for very techy stuff.

I use: Studio One "Bug" Pro v4.51 & v3.56 on an i7 7700 win10 PC w16GB RAM and on a Mac Pro Tower (Sierra) w/RME & Focusrite interfaces.

When not loitering here, I can be found at: http://RolandK.ca

Attention all shoppers: deception and commerce are old friends. Ask questions; don't just nod and agree as expected.
[Unless it's "On sale" with a warning to "Hurry. Act now!" so you can also get a "FREE" [whatever] — what an awesome deal!]
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by lfo2k on Mon May 27, 2019 12:32 pm
Well...... the support : )

They would have to give the problem to the developers i think. But if the support does not understand where the problems is, you feel a little lost.
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by robertgray3 on Mon May 27, 2019 1:17 pm
roland1 wroteSo who is supposed to do the real techie stuff, us here on the forum?


You can see why Ableton adopted the model they did where basically any user who really cares can sign up to chime in on the software. I don't know how well it actually works for them but it makes sense. If you volunteer to give feedback, it feels a lot better when you're having to report issues than if you never signed up to in the first place.

Mac OS X Mojave 10.14.4
Mac Pro (Late 2013)
3 GHz 8-Core Intel Xeon E5
32 GB 1066 MHz DDR3
Dual AMD FirePro D500 3072 MB
Quantum 2

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