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Anyone know if there is a fix yet for busses randomly moving on their own. One or two move to the end or the my master and vox bus randomly move to the middle etc... This has been happening since v3. As much as I love it I've about had it with this DAW especially with an issue that should really be elementary to fix. Anyone?.... Buehler?
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by miked7 on Sat Feb 16, 2019 8:08 pm
I get this occasionally too and even started up a support ticket. It is frustrating but also hard to reproduce reliably. It works fine most of the time. Actually, that's why I stopped using folders in v3 because there was a problem with the channels jumping around. I think that has been fixed, but I still haven't gotten back to using them...

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by jpettit on Sat Feb 16, 2019 8:17 pm
joshuaelie wroteAnyone know if there is a fix yet for busses randomly moving on their own. One or two move to the end or the my master and vox bus randomly move to the middle etc... This has been happening since v3. As much as I love it I've about had it with this DAW especially with an issue that should really be elementary to fix. Anyone?.... Buehler?

Tell us what your setting s are.
Do you have busses to the right off?
Are you working with Mult-instruments?
Are you working with Buss folders?
Can you describe when y0ou see it happen?

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by Robdp on Sun Feb 17, 2019 6:50 pm
I still get this happen and it's been a bug for me since version 3. I've had a new iMac and MBP and drives since then and have done multiple fresh installs with new templates built from scratch yet the problem is still there.

Unfortunately its very difficult to reproduce. I'll be mixing or switching between windows and suddenly my buses will have or scattered themselves everywhere in the mix window.

Also, still getting the Mix window height bug happen too. Not sure if they are related.

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by robertgray3 on Mon Feb 18, 2019 8:36 am
Do you guys have multiple monitors?

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by codyhazelle on Mon Feb 18, 2019 1:49 pm
I've had this problem for a while too and agree that it's hard to replicate. I have unticked "busses/FX remain to the right" or whatever it is. Sometimes even FX will move. Let's say I have a reverb send for a guitar and I put it directly next to the guitar track, sometimes I find that I open up my mixer and it's moved somewhere else entirely. It's pretty crazy.

But I don't know how/when it happens, all I know is that it happens and I end up reordering my busses/sends sometimes.

No I'm not using two monitors.

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by niles on Mon Feb 18, 2019 2:18 pm
When there are buses and FX buses present in the song that don't have envelope tracks attached, channels wil eventually risk going all over the place when tracks are added and/or moved in the arrangement view, since they are not visible there.

The way to work around that is to create envelope tracks for any (FX) bus. This can also be done automatically by enabling Options > Advanced > Automation > Automatically create automation tracks for channels.

I can't guarantee it will solve everything, but I'm positive it does solve issues with buses moving to locations one does not expect, since a bus with an envelope is also visible (and physical) in the arrangement.

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by miked7 on Mon Feb 18, 2019 2:48 pm
niles wroteWhen there are buses and FX buses present in the song that don't have envelope tracks attached, channels wil eventually risk going all over the place when tracks are added and/or moved in the arrangement view, since they are not visible there.

The way to work around that is to create envelope tracks for any (FX) bus. This can also be done automatically by enabling Options > Advanced > Automation > Automatically create automation tracks for channels.
...

This makes a lot of sense.

For my "Grouping" settings: 1. Keep FX to right = NO 2. Keep bus channels to right = NO 3. Keep VCA channels to right = YES 4. Preserve order of channels with folder track = YES

In fact, this makes so much sense, I may even start using folders again and see how it goes. :+1

BTW, no multiple monitors for me.

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by patricemazmanian on Tue Feb 19, 2019 2:03 am
niles wroteWhen there are buses and FX buses present in the song that don't have envelope tracks attached, channels wil eventually risk going all over the place when tracks are added and/or moved in the arrangement view, since they are not visible there.

The way to work around that is to create envelope tracks for any (FX) bus. This can also be done automatically by enabling Options > Advanced > Automation > Automatically create automation tracks for channels.


The problem is that it overloads the arrangement view, while we do not need FX or BUS at this location.
So when it's disorganized, I put the console in order. I prefer to work that way!
My settings:
Keep FX to right = NO
Keep bus channels to right = NO
Keep VCA channels to right = NO

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by joshuaelie on Tue Feb 19, 2019 4:16 am
First I really appreciate everyone jumping in on this. They seriously just randomly move. Not when I'm really do anything major. Even just start and stop playback. Happens multiple times a session.

Not using buss folders
Yes busses to the right is unchecked
(cause that messes up my workflow)
Yes I'm using some multi-instruments
Modern & Massive(drums), Shreddage Bass, and Waves Grand Rhapsody mainly.

I like my busses to right of what's bussing to them but they don't f-ing stay there haha I really don't think it's a settings problem because the only thing I have changed is busses to the right and the appearance. Maybe it's demons.... or Kanye. Ya it might be Kanye messin with me...
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by joshuaelie on Tue Feb 19, 2019 4:19 am
Oh and sorry for the late response I didn't get any kind of notification anyone cared haha
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by niles on Tue Feb 19, 2019 6:36 am
patricemazmanian wrote
niles wroteWhen there are buses and FX buses present in the song that don't have envelope tracks attached, channels wil eventually risk going all over the place when tracks are added and/or moved in the arrangement view, since they are not visible there.

The way to work around that is to create envelope tracks for any (FX) bus. This can also be done automatically by enabling Options > Advanced > Automation > Automatically create automation tracks for channels.


The problem is that it overloads the arrangement view, while we do not need FX or BUS at this location.
I agree that it clutters the arrangement. I prefer your method too, but my songs do not go over a couple of dozen channels, so that's easy to maintain manually. :)

Anyway I think it's good to understand this is one of the conditions and solutions regarding moving buses.

Regarding @joshuaelie issue it's hard to pinpoint what's going on without seeing the song + system where it occurs.

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by dongbach on Mon Oct 05, 2020 8:32 pm
robertgray3 wroteDo you guys have multiple monitors?

Yes. I use 2 monitors same problem.
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by Baphometrix on Tue Oct 06, 2020 10:04 am
I use two monitors as well and have the same problem in v5.x Pro,

It's so unpredictable that I've simply stopped using folder tracks entirely. And I have the options checked to always keep all my FX, Busses, and VCAs over on the right hand side of the Console. That seems to be the only way to prevent the console channels from (randomly?) jumping around when you add or move tracks up in the Arranger.

I can see how folder tracks work great when you bring in 50 stems, arrange them in order by related sounds and color them, and THEN select each chunk of tracks and put them inside a folder track. When you work this way, you're not (usually) adding entirely new audio/instrument tracks to the arrangement anymore. At most you're just adding automation tracks here and there. The Console seems to be very well-behaved in this workflow and won't be as prone to scramble itself around.

The problem arises when you're producing in Studio One and building a song up from scratch (or from a starting template). As you add tracks and re-order tracks in the Arranger, the Console order just goes haywire if you're using folder tracks, or even if you're trying to keep some types of channels (like busses) near the tracks, but other types of channels (like FX or VCAs) over on the right.

It would be great if they could nail down this problem and fix it, though. It's annoying and I'd rather have the flexibility to use folder tracks up in the Arranger.

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by robertgray3 on Tue Oct 06, 2020 10:14 am
shannongreywalker wroteIt would be great if they could nail down this problem and fix it, though.


If someone can show how to make it happen with some steps to follow they’re usually pretty responsive and quick past that point. Most of the time it’ll get fixed within one or two updates.

I'm pretty sure I can reproduce this "issue" as far as folder tracks go, but I have a hunch it's more of a design shortcoming with how they let you place buses in the Console without any real representation of Console folder assignment. If it is, it could be a feature request and might take a much longer time to be addressed.

What gives me that impression is the fact that Buses don’t appear to be in a folder unless you create an Automation track for them. They're just displayed between the Channels in the folder in the Console. If you collapse the Folder and have "Link expansion and visibility of folder tracks" enabled, you'll see that they're really positioned after the folder and temporarily display elsewhere when it’s open. It’s confusing to say the least.

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by Baphometrix on Wed Oct 07, 2020 9:51 pm
Except you'll find several "Presonus Answers" threads about this exact issue, going back one or two years now, with significant upvotes. I get the impression this problem has been around for a while and therefore isn't likely to be fixed any time soon.

It's hard to find threads in the Presonus Answers system, but here's one I remember. I also remember seeing others that mention this problem.

https://answers.presonus.com/13584/show ... ync-issues

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by robertgray3 on Thu Oct 08, 2020 11:53 am
shannongreywalker wroteExcept you'll find several "Presonus Answers" threads about this exact issue, going back one or two years now, with significant upvotes. I get the impression this problem has been around for a while and therefore isn't likely to be fixed any time soon.


Speaking specifically to the folder-track related bus behavior- that Answers page is a feature request. A good one, totally, but there were features added in version 5.0 that were requested in version 1.0 of the DAW. Unfortunately, those things can take some time.

As for the totally random bus movement, if you have a few steps that result in unexpected behavior send them in to Support. That’s the only way to start the ball rolling on a fix. Multi monitor setups have had issues with this before so that might help narrow it down.

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by Baphometrix on Fri Oct 09, 2020 6:33 am
Just a few more examples (five). This time from one obvious search string in the forums. This problem seems to have been around since v3. And still isn't fixed. In all that time, this hasn't likely been reported to Presonus yet?

viewtopic.php?f=151&t=24623&hilit=bus+channels+moving

viewtopic.php?f=151&t=20828&hilit=bus+channels+moving

viewtopic.php?f=151&t=16610&hilit=bus+channels+moving

viewtopic.php?f=151&t=17021&hilit=bus+channels+moving

viewtopic.php?f=151&t=9458&hilit=bus+channels+moving

FWIW, my project template definitely has multi-channel instruments (like Impact XT) that have several multi-out channels in the console. So: one Arranger track for Impact XT, associated with ~8 console channels for the ST sub-busses in that instrument. So this is one of the trigger conditions reported in the 2nd link above, from way back in 2016.

And I ran into this random bus/fx channel movement ALL THE TIME when first designing my main project template with folder tracks. (I started with v5 Pro; relatively new to S1.)

I finally had to give up and just NOT use folder tracks in the Arranger at all. Just straight instrument/audio/automation tracks, and down in the Console, all my arranger tracks on the left side, and all my FX, Bus, and VCA channels set to stay on the right. This is the only solution that works.

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by robertgray3 on Fri Oct 09, 2020 1:37 pm
shannongreywalker wroteI ran into this random bus/fx channel movement ALL THE TIME when first designing my main project template with folder tracks. (I started with v5 Pro; relatively new to S1.)


None of those posts really help reproduce the issue. Do you have one of those problematic templates where this issue would come up for you? If you send it to me, I'll start my next song with it on multi-monitor and see what happens. For someone to duplicate template issues they need the template file and the data file from the templates folder as well.

I use Folder Tracks and a Multi-Out impact in my main template but it may be setup differently than yours. I have personally never seen a bus move around on its own. Whether it's because of different steps or different hardware, I have no clue but I'd be happy to help figure it out.

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by Baphometrix on Fri Oct 09, 2020 7:08 pm
robertgray3 wrote
shannongreywalker wroteI ran into this random bus/fx channel movement ALL THE TIME when first designing my main project template with folder tracks. (I started with v5 Pro; relatively new to S1.)


None of those posts really help reproduce the issue. Do you have one of those problematic templates where this issue would come up for you? If you send it to me, I'll start my next song with it on multi-monitor and see what happens. For someone to duplicate template issues they need the template file and the data file from the templates folder as well.

I use Folder Tracks and a Multi-Out impact in my main template but it may be setup differently than yours. I have personally never seen a bus move around on its own. Whether it's because of different steps or different hardware, I have no clue but I'd be happy to help figure it out.


I appreciate the offer, but those problematic early templates are long gone.

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