PreSonus Forums

HI Guys. Been a passive forum member since years. I think this is prolly my very first "Help Me" post on the forum, ever . . .lol.
I would really appreciate your help.

I use Kontakt and other virtual instruments quite regularly - especially for keyboards and horns. Very often, I use (virtual) Hammond organ tracks. Here is my dilemma:

I need to pass mod wheel (or maybe sustain pedal) midi data into T-Racks Leslie or possibly Amplitube Leslie. For that matter, it could be any leslie plugin. The point is, rather than the organ plugin receiving the modwheel data, to change Leslie speeds, I want the plugin to receive the CC instead.

I've been trying to figure out a way to accomplish this, but I can't for the life of me figure out how to do it. For some reason, I thought it would be simple, since most of the Leslie plugins are already configured out-of-the-box to receive midi messages from cc 64 or cc 1. The trouble is, how do I pass that info along from the virtual hammond? Whether it's VB3, Blue3, Kontakt, and et cetera.

Anybody? Please?

I'm unclear about what you're trying to do.

Have you read the chapter in the manual about control link?

If you want a midi controller to automate a parameter on an audio effect, I think control link is the way.

Good to describe specifics, like I used this plug in but I couldn't get it to do this etc.

Also good to have your specs in your signature.

Hi Tacman. I’m using Windows 10.
I’m using both S1 3 or S1 4; take ur pick.
What am I not describing well enough? If I want to bypass the inferior Leslie effect built into any given Hammond VI (Let’s use Kontakt with Vintage Organs as an example), and instead send the midi data (in this case my mod wheel) to IK Multimdia’s “T Racks 5 Leslie”, or Melda’s “mVintageRotary”, or UVI’s “Rotary”, or any other FX, how do I go about it? And yes, the (take ur pick) Leslie emulating plugin is inserted as a normal audio FX on the virtual instrument channel/track.

Studio One doesn't have MIDI sends, so you'll have to add an extra Instrument track with its output pointing to the Leslie VST. If the input of that track is an external controller or a VST Instrument depends on if the VST Instrument is sending out the proper controller data for the Leslie VST. Since Studio One is not able to transform nor filter MIDI messages by itself.

Honestly, at this point, I would recommend simplifying your track and bouncing the organ to audio. Then add the leslie effect to that audio track and automate it. While you should be able to do what you are trying to do, not all plugins play nice together. Rather than fight with it, bounce and move on.

Dan

Thanks, Dan. Without rendering first, I usually end up using automation as you’ve suggested — it accomplishes the same task. However, I wanted to control “Leslie” speeds in real-time, in this instance. Oh well, at least I know that I needn’t bang my head against the Studio One wall any further, on this particular quest.

dcumpian wroteHonestly, at this point, I would recommend simplifying your track and bouncing the organ to audio. Then add the leslie effect to that audio track and automate it. While you should be able to do what you are trying to do, not all plugins play nice together. Rather than fight with it, bounce and move on.

Dan

The midi is going to the plugins as far as I can tell. I haven't used control link so I have to read up on it.

I put an organ on my instrument track (sonic 3) and added a leslie fx insert.

So the mod wheel moves the controls but I don't know how to bind them, like I say, have to read up on that.

The mod wheel moves the controls

Does your Virtual Hammond already respond to modwheel in the first place? Can you disable it? For instance, let's say your virtual hammond plugin is already assigned to change Leslie speed via modwheel...can you entirely disable the Leslie, thus effectively rendering the modwheel functionality null and void? This is what I do with Acoustic Samples B5 running in UVI workstation.

If yes, that's good. You can't turn off just the modwheel in Studio One itself, but you should be able to undo any modwheel assignments in your plugin, which solves for that problem.

Now you've got a few choices about how to do this:

Option 1. Use Control Link in Studio One (easier)
Option 2. Do this by transmitting MIDI on instrument tracks directly to plugins

So if you want to go via option 1 then you'd

A. Setup your control surface in Studio One (watch Youtube videos on Control LInk if you don't know how) - be sure to include Modwheel in the "Learn" process
B. Load up your T-Racks Leslie or whatever plugin on your organ track
C. Map modwheel or whatever other MIDI parameter to the Leslie speed control using Studio One's Control Link functionality. I just did this here and it works great.

If you want to go option 2, you'd want to:

A. Load up your VST effect on your organ track
B. Create a brand new Instrument Track, Input should be your controller, Output should be your Leslie plugin(s) (if you don't see the plugin in the MIDI Output list, it's because the plugin doesn't accept MIDI).
C. Open the Leslie plugin and configure it to receive MIDI from the appropriate controller info
D. Arm both instrument tracks as you record your performance

You'll end up with two copies of the performance. One with MIDI going to the organ plugin where the modwheel has no effect, and another where the modwheel portion of the MIDI is going to the Leslie plugin.

I recommend option 1.

I got this to work fine using only one Instrument Track as well. I did it with Kontakt 6 Player (with an organ sound) and PSP L'otary in the audio insert. I did have tell the Kontakt player to pass the incoming midi CC signals on via some settings in there. I also has to stop what the Mod Wheel was doing in the Kontakt organ as well which was easy.

I had to open the channel editor and make Knob 1 control the Lever in L'otary. Which is easy to do. It was then a matter of linking the incoming Mod Wheel messages to this knob and it all worked great.

Niles is correct on this though. I think it depends on the ability of the organ VST to output the incoming Mod Wheel data from your controller.

Sounds like a nifty plan. Now then, do tell . . . What settings did you change in Kontakt, my friend?

Jemusic wroteI got this to work fine using only one Instrument Track as well. I did it with Kontakt 6 Player (with an organ sound) and PSP L'otary in the audio insert. I did have tell the Kontakt player to pass the incoming midi CC signals on via some settings in there. I also has to stop what the Mod Wheel was doing in the Kontakt organ as well which was easy.

I had to open the channel editor and make Knob 1 control the Lever in L'otary. Which is easy to do. It was then a matter of linking the incoming Mod Wheel messages to this knob and it all worked great.

Niles is correct on this though. I think it depends on the ability of the organ VST to output the incoming Mod Wheel data from your controller.

I got it working, watched a bit of youtube about control link.

It only works when the leslie fx is visible, close it and it stops working. Open it and it's working again.

More reading.

With Kontakt (player) installed there is a cog wheel right up the very top. Click on that. Look under Engine. One of the Options is Send Midi to Outside World. Click on that. I had to tick incoming CC's.

Tacman7 wroteI got it working, watched a bit of youtube about control link.

It only works when the leslie fx is visible, close it and it stops working. Open it and it's working again.More reading.

Not sure about this. This seems to work for me whether the plugin was visible or not but I may need to confirm. As I did have it open a lot of the time but I do remember closing everything at one stage and nothing changed.

ahh, Kool! Thnx a million - much appreciated. Yes! Of course, that makes sence. *Forehead Palm moment.

Jemusic wroteWith Kontakt (player) installed there is a cog wheel right up the very top. Click on that. Look under Engine. One of the Options is Send Midi to Outside World. Click on that. I had to tick incoming CC's.

Thanks for the help, guys, but I still can’t accomlish what I want. I don’t like having to keep the plugin window active on my screen for one thing, and for another, the vst isn’t actually passing the midi data directly to the Leslie plugin.

The funny thing is, it’s absolutely idiot-proof to accomplish this simple task within Acousica’s Mixcraft. No additional routing required at all. I instantiate Kontakt, load up Vintage Organs library, configure Kontakt to pass midi CCs to “outside world”, and the Leslie plugin grabs modwheel action flawlesssly.

Another cool thing about Mixcraft (since years) is its ability to add multiple midi lanes per instrument track, and transmit over multiple midi channels on a SINGLE midi track. Mixcraft is easily twice as CPU efficient. Studio One is hugely lacking in these regards.

All I want to do, is bypass the VST’s inferior built-in Leslie effect and pass midi cc1 on to a dedicated FX plugin. I’m left with manually adding plugin automation. It’s amusing that a novice’s DAW (Mixcraft) can do these midi tasks so easily, and the pro-grade DAW cannot. *Rolling eyes.

Studio One offers a better workflow and more professional features. The quality of its DSP processing and audio engine are superior. Alas, it’s midi functionality is only “so so”.

Just add two instrument tracks to a folder, one for the organ one for the leslie.
I'm the last to say Studio One is musician friendly in the musical data department, but this isn't a biggie to solve and the solution was already given twice. Not as elegant as the competition, but it works.

Alternatively you can wrap the organ and leslie in something like Komplete Kontrol if you own that one.

Hi Niles. Thanx, I’ll try the folder trick. I couldn’t get it to work as two individual tracks. Maybe the folder will make the difference.

niles wroteJust add two instrument tracks to a folder, one for the organ one for the leslie.
I'm the last to say Studio One is musician friendly in the musical data department, but this isn't a biggie to solve and the solution was already given twice. Not as elegant as the competition, but it works.

Alternatively you can wrap the organ and leslie in something like Komplete Kontrol if you own that one.

How do you add the Leslie plugin to the second instrument track? When you create an instrument track with no virtual instruments present, it does not even appear in the mixer. So I am rather curious as to how one creates an instrument track with only the Leslie plugin inserted.

Jemusic wroteHow do you add the Leslie plugin to the second instrument track? When you create an instrument track with no virtual instruments present, it does not even appear in the mixer. So I am rather curious as to how one creates an instrument track with only the Leslie plugin inserted.

The leslie is on the audio channel of the organ. An instrument track's MIDI out is pointing to that leslie.

Charles Allen wroteHi Niles. Thanx, I’ll try the folder trick. I couldn’t get it to work as two individual tracks. Maybe the folder will make the difference.

Make sure it's armed.

I am still confused. You are not clear about what is exactly in the two instrument tracks. Does one have the organ only and the other the organ followed by the Leslie. Or do the two instrument tracks have the organ followed by the Leslie and if so why?

I managed to get all this to work with one instrument track, organ followed by Leslie.