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I have StudioOne Pro v3, but I'm still using v2. Duh, I can crank up v3 if necessary.

I need to record my first video of an acoustic guitar/vocal performance. I don't want to wear headphones in the video. Instead I would like to run StudioOne on a nearby laptop, and watch the display as I record.

On the laptop display, which is out of camera shot (eight feet / two meters away) would be a BIG visual representation of the click track / metronome. Maybe red on the downbeat and green on 2,3 and 4. I'd be able to keep time without the microphones picking up any audible metronome/click.

Does anybody here know of a way to accomplish this?

Thanks
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by Bbd on Thu Jun 29, 2017 12:58 pm
Maybe these ideas:

1. Create a midi track for the metronome and expand the view to taste.
2. Create a midi track for the metronome and send the output to a midi pad controller to see the lights light up.
3. Skip the visual and use a small earphone!
:)

Bbd

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by scottmoncrieff on Thu Jun 29, 2017 1:16 pm
A visual metronome gadget is something I included in the 3D GUI SO3 set I created. It's used in conjunction with a free utility app which is used to display it and also control the speed or rate of. It's included in Set 2, the link can be found in post 11 near the bottom of the page. There is no connection with Studio One so it is completely independent on it's own. Essentially it's a set of 16.png's, the utility program acts as an overlay as well as allowing the visual metronome to be scaled to twice it's default size. I don't know what platform you are on but the utility requires Windows 7 or above. If you are on a Mac there should be animation software for you to help cycle the images as required. There is a video of it in action on the following page also.

You can find all the information you need by clicking here if it's any use to you...

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by Tom Overthere on Thu Jun 29, 2017 2:05 pm
Thanks, Bdb.
I'll see if I can implement one of those three, and in the end...it might just be #3 afterall. :mrgreen:

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by Tom Overthere on Thu Jun 29, 2017 2:11 pm
Thanks, Scott.
I found your thread when I first searched the forum based on "visual metronome." I ruled the option out though, because I'm confused enough :shock: just trying to learn StudioOne in it's basic form. I'm not ready to add features that go "beyond the basics", though I'm sure your enhancements are useful to folks who actually know what they're doing... :mrgreen:

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by Tom Overthere on Thu Jun 29, 2017 3:28 pm
I saw where another StudioOne user put in a "feature request" for exactly what I need: a large-format visual metronome.

I added my +1 to that idea for a total of 9 votes. If you guys have time, please drop by that link and add your own vote.

Such a feature would be very useful in situations like mine, or for a choral ensemble where you can't provide enough cue headphones. Just have the singers watch the laptop display for timing/tempo.

Here's the link:
http://answers.presonus.com/13863/visual-metronome?show=13863#q13863

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by niles on Thu Jun 29, 2017 4:37 pm
Tom Overthere wroteMaybe red on the downbeat and green on 2,3 and 4. I'd be able to keep time without the microphones picking up any audible metronome/click.

Does anybody here know of a way to accomplish this?
You could try Image in combination with a MIDI track. It's free and can even run full screen and you can set it up the way you like.

Image

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by Tom Overthere on Thu Jun 29, 2017 5:56 pm
niles wroteYou could try Image in combination with a MIDI track. It's free and can even run full screen and you can set it up the way you like.

Thanks a lot, niles! And thanks for the animated .GIF image. That really proves your point. :mrgreen:

I'm so far behind in learning StudioOne...haven't even installed v3 yet. I'll download from the link you provided and see if I can fake my way through enough MIDI to make it work. Too good, niles. Thanks a lot.

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by Bbd on Thu Jun 29, 2017 8:45 pm
Remember choirs, you lead them with a conductor. He may need headphones but will not want to stare at a monitor.

Trying to keep up with a visual metronome can be tough because you also want to pay attention to you instrument as well.
Strongly recommend earphones!

Bbd

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by mikemanthei on Thu Jun 29, 2017 9:21 pm
Bbd wroteRemember choirs, you lead them with a conductor. He may need headphones but will not want to stare at a monitor.

Trying to keep up with a visual metronome can be tough because you also want to pay attention to you instrument as well.
Strongly recommend earphones!


Yeah that's kind of my thoughts too. I remember somebody doing a report on a visual metronome some years ago and said something to the effect that music is one side of the brain and visual is the other side and it got confusing trying to track audible music to a visual metronome.


Whether that's true for everyone is just a guess but I can sure see where that could be confusing for some of us. It's really quite an interesting concept

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by Bbd on Thu Jun 29, 2017 9:35 pm
It is an interesting concept, I agree.

More than a concept, I rigged up a flashing light that I mounted on my kick drum to help me keep time with a band rehearsing for an album being recorded for A&M Records a long time ago.
As the drummer, I had to keep staring at the light in order to stay with it. If I took my eyes off just to look around, and then looked back at the flashing light, I might see that I was off. Then I would adjust to get back with it.
It was not a good idea because I could not relax and simply groove with the music.
An audible click track is different because we hear it and feel it instead of seeing it.
If you are doing a video and don't want people to know you are following a click, they won't mind if you use a small earpiece. No one cares. But to possibly see the artist staring at something while playing wouldn't help either IMO.
Anyway, to each their own. Whatever works is fine with me.

Bbd

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by Tom Overthere on Thu Jun 29, 2017 10:33 pm
First of all, "Conductors?! We don' need no steenkeen CONDUCTORS!" :mrgreen:
You're right about the conductor, of course, IF the choral group is a traditional, organized choir - but in my world things are not so predictable.

With regard to the recent posts questioning the viability of a visual metronome, I'll say this: The much-appreciated animated .GIF image file provided by forum member niles is running at a quick tempo, which makes things more difficult, but I tried playing a very simple, repetitive guitar melody in time with it's Red and Green visual cues. It was almost impossible for me.

Gee, it seemed like such a good idea in theory... :| (how many times have I said that?)

As Bbd mentioned above, take your eyes off it for a few seconds and you get lost. :shock: So even though this is not the outcome I had hoped for, niles' animation plus the written comments by everyone in this thread have probably spared me from spending time/money/frustration on something that wouldn't work out. Thanks to you all.

As has been suggested, I'll probably stick an ear bud in my right ear and call it "good enough."

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by Bbd on Fri Jun 30, 2017 1:19 am
I think you are making the right decision.

This thread reminded me of my old studio days.

For large choirs, I ran a studio in L.A. and had a large recording room and about 30 singers.
They were overdubbing onto a soundtrack.
I ended up putting small speakers in the room behind the mics because I did not have 30 headphones. I kept the volume as low as possible and only made the cue mix the basics to keep the choir on time and on pitch.
It worked good. Not great because of some bleed but it got the job done and after tracking them, all was good.

Bbd

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by Tom Overthere on Fri Jun 30, 2017 7:59 am
Bbd wroteI think you are making the right decision.
This thread reminded me of my old studio days.

You've been dead-on throughout this thread. I appreciate your POV and take your suggestions seriously. :+1


Bbd wroteI ended up putting small speakers in the room behind the mics because I did not have 30 headphones. I kept the volume as low as possible and only made the cue mix the basics to keep the choir on time and on pitch.
It worked good. Not great because of some bleed but it got the job done and after tracking them, all was good.

GREAT MINDS THINK ALIKE. I've been wondering if I could get away with outputting the click track at low volume on a small speaker set behind the mics as much as possible (will have to 'split the difference' between guitar and vocal mics). I may add simple percussion and bass, so the bleed might not be a problem.

Beyond that, your comment about keeping the choir on pitch has given me another idea: In this particular song I'm having trouble singing a few of the notes while playing guitar. It might help if I play the vocal melody via synth and include that track along with the click track - whether I go with the earbud or the small speaker. Hearing even just a hint of the melody should help me match the pitch.

So once again, this discussion is proving to be not only instructive, but "mind expanding." WooHoo. :mrgreen:

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by niles on Fri Jun 30, 2017 8:18 am
Before you start recording and have everything set up you could always record a blank version of the click through all mics so you can phase invert a bleeding click out later on when it gets in your way.... in theory :)

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by matthewgorman on Fri Jun 30, 2017 9:00 am
Late to the party. The problem is the drummer hearing the click over the kits. What I do is have the drummer use earbuds, and over top of them, a pair of noise suppression headphones like they use at an airport or gun range. They have different noise suppression ratings, up to 120db. Works great to keep out the ambient bleed from the drummers monitoring, which is really what the problem is.

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by Tom Overthere on Fri Jun 30, 2017 9:17 am
niles wroteBefore you start recording and have everything set up you could always record a blank version of the click through all mics so you can phase invert a bleeding click out later on when it gets in your way.... in theory :)

Yes, in theory... :mrgreen:

Am I understanding correctly?

1. Render a standard click track to Audio Track 1.

2. Play back the click track through a speaker and let the mics record just that to Track 2. Don't record guitar and vocal yet.

3. Play the original click track again (Track 1) through the speaker, but this time DO record the guitar and vocal parts onto Tracks 3 and 4.

4. INVERT PHASE of Track 2 (just the click recorded by the mics) and adjust the mix to see if that inverted Track 2 signal cancels out the "click" on the guitar and vocal Tracks 3 and 4.
Last edited by Tom Overthere on Fri Jun 30, 2017 9:46 am, edited 1 time in total.

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by matthewgorman on Fri Jun 30, 2017 9:21 am
matthewgorman wroteLate to the party. The problem is the drummer hearing the click over the kits. What I do is have the drummer use earbuds, and over top of them, a pair of noise suppression headphones like they use at an airport or gun range. They have different noise suppression ratings, up to 120db. Works great to keep out the ambient bleed from the drummers monitoring, which is really what the problem is.


Sorry, just reread and saw you were working with acoustic. Same principle, but the click shouldn't need to be that loud for acoustic guitar to make bleed a problem?

Good luck either way.

Matt

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by Tom Overthere on Fri Jun 30, 2017 9:45 am
matthewgorman wroteSorry, just reread and saw you were working with acoustic. Same principle, but the click shouldn't need to be that loud for acoustic guitar to make bleed a problem? Good luck either way.

Thanks, Matt. It's surprising how when I WANT a mic to pickup some ambient sound it WON'T. And when I DON'T want it, there's sound spilling EVERYWHERE! :mrgreen: Murphy's Law lives in my basement.

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by niles on Fri Jun 30, 2017 11:00 am
Tom Overthere wrote2. Play back the click track through a speaker and let the mics record just that to Track 2. Don't record guitar and vocal yet.
Yes, but each mic should record the pickup on it's own track. After all the click on the vocal mic wont cancel out the click on the guitar mic(s) since it's a different position and thus a different sonic content.

But indeed, all theory and I think Matt and Bbd have practical advice :geek:

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