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Update
Well I am quite surprised here! I have got a decent oscilloscope and did excatly what I said in my previous post. I set up V2 and V3 and created a long note in both at C4. I set both Mojito's for a square wave with no sub oscillators in both as yet. The oscilloscope revealed both were identical. Until however until I dialed in the sub osc in both. The resulting waveforms were completely different! What is interesting here though is that in V3 the resultant waveform actually looked clean and very precise. In V2 it looked almost weird and very strange. So one could say in fact that it may have been broken in V2 and it is fixed now in V3! Pity it does not sound that way. Also put an instance of Span (Spectrum analyser) over both while running at the same time and the spectral graphs are also quite different as well. This confirms what you have been hearing. They are very different sounding sub oscillators! It also confirms what I found too and that they are both very identical when the sub osc is not used.
Specs i5-2500K 3.5 Ghz-8 Gb RAM-Win 7 64 bit - ATI Radeon HD6900 Series - RME HDSP9632 - Midex 8 Midi interface - Faderport 2/8 - Atom Pad/Atom SQ - HP Laptop Win 10 - Studio 24c interface -iMac 2.5Ghz Core i5 - High Sierra 10.13.6 - Focusrite Clarett 2 Pre & Scarlett 18i20. Studio One V5.5 (Mac and V6.5 Win 10 laptop), Notion 6.8, Ableton Live 11 Suite, LaunchPad Pro
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Ok there is more!
There is a way to shut off the main oscillator and only hear the sub oscillator. The way you do it is select a square wave as the main oscillator but then rotate the width control fully anti clockwise so the square wave disappears. You will be left with the sub oscillator sound only then. When you view the sub oscillator waveform and you can even use the Studio One scope to do this you will find in V2 the sub osc is always a pure sine wave. In V3 it is a sawtooth wave so there you go. You were very right they have two very different sounds. The sub sawtooth sound is also going to add the extra harmonics hence the change in sound as well. I think I like the idea of the sub sinewave as it is deep and pure and has no harmonics present. I think I missed it at first because of the presence of the main oscillator being there and quite loud. The sub osc does not change its waveform either no matter what the main osc is. It is either a sinewave (V2) or a sawtooth wave (V3) It is also louder too in V2 in amplitude (twice the peak to peak voltage by the way which is significant) hence the reason it sounds a little deeper. You would think once you close the filter right down the sawtooth wave would sort of turn into a sinewave and it does but as it is only half the amplitude that explains why the V2 sound is quite fatter down the bottom end.
Specs i5-2500K 3.5 Ghz-8 Gb RAM-Win 7 64 bit - ATI Radeon HD6900 Series - RME HDSP9632 - Midex 8 Midi interface - Faderport 2/8 - Atom Pad/Atom SQ - HP Laptop Win 10 - Studio 24c interface -iMac 2.5Ghz Core i5 - High Sierra 10.13.6 - Focusrite Clarett 2 Pre & Scarlett 18i20. Studio One V5.5 (Mac and V6.5 Win 10 laptop), Notion 6.8, Ableton Live 11 Suite, LaunchPad Pro
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I don't use Mojito, but good job on detecting this, guys. If there's only one option a sine wave is the sound choice for a sub oscillator. Ought to be a bug.
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I can confirm the Sub OSC is broken in version 3. In version 3 it's not a sinus, it's more like some asymmetrical saw'ish wave form.
A simple test to check the difference is isolating the sub oscillator by nullifying the main oscillator (song file is at the bottom of this post). Reproducible steps:
Result Studio One 2: A sinus sound at 220hz  Result Studio One 3: A crippled saw sound  Expected result: A sinus sound at 220hz (like Studio One v2). Song file
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Thanks guys. Well, i hope support pay attention to this and will fix the problem.
I understand that there are many third-party vsti, but sometimes there are circumstances when wants\need to use only built in DAW instruments. |
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Thanks to the OP for bringing it up and also to NIles for confirming. This thread got me playing with Mojito quite a bit and I like it and will use it much more for sure. I hope they can sort this. I don't mind the fact the sub osc is a sine wave (or supposed to be!) because it has that deep sound down low which is what you want usually for a sub osc.
Specs i5-2500K 3.5 Ghz-8 Gb RAM-Win 7 64 bit - ATI Radeon HD6900 Series - RME HDSP9632 - Midex 8 Midi interface - Faderport 2/8 - Atom Pad/Atom SQ - HP Laptop Win 10 - Studio 24c interface -iMac 2.5Ghz Core i5 - High Sierra 10.13.6 - Focusrite Clarett 2 Pre & Scarlett 18i20. Studio One V5.5 (Mac and V6.5 Win 10 laptop), Notion 6.8, Ableton Live 11 Suite, LaunchPad Pro
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Jemusic
That's funny case, i just upgraded couple days ago from v2 to v3 (finally), and the first thing what I did after installing v3 it compared the sound of Mojito in both versions, just mojito the first thing that came to hand (compare to identify the difference of sound engine of both DAW versions, what the paranoia by itself - I understand, but just in case), and what was my surprise when I heard less low frequency in the new version   . It was a painful disappointment. But it is good that it just a coincidence.But I must say that Mojito with properly sub-bass (as in v2) sounds really not bad, it was also some opening for me. Although before I had almost not tried to use it. |
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A great feature of Mojito would be the ability for the main oscillator to have a variable output level the same as the sub osc. Many interesting synth bass sounds can be made by using the sub osc as the main level part of the sound and only having a hit of the +8va normal osc sound in there.
It would be good if the sub osc had some waveform options. I have worked with the Juno 106 for a long time and liked the sub osc being a square wave. More harmonics to make an interesting synth bass sound. Like a deep sound with a sharp attack. The sine wave gives a beautiful warm deep fat sound though. Adding in weight to the main osc sound. The main oscillator is sounding great right now in V3. It sounds excellent down in the bass register. With a fat healthy sinwave sub osc though you are adding like 20 Hz depth to your 40Hz bass notes! I used to teach audio in an audio school that had a control room that could reproduce 20Hz so well it was amazing. You could hear it so clearly. They were 2 x 15" soffit JBL's per side. I loved it! Electronic music sounded incredible on those monitors!
Specs i5-2500K 3.5 Ghz-8 Gb RAM-Win 7 64 bit - ATI Radeon HD6900 Series - RME HDSP9632 - Midex 8 Midi interface - Faderport 2/8 - Atom Pad/Atom SQ - HP Laptop Win 10 - Studio 24c interface -iMac 2.5Ghz Core i5 - High Sierra 10.13.6 - Focusrite Clarett 2 Pre & Scarlett 18i20. Studio One V5.5 (Mac and V6.5 Win 10 laptop), Notion 6.8, Ableton Live 11 Suite, LaunchPad Pro
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Yeah. I wrote previously about the sine wave being the sub osc shape of my choice. However, after looking into it a bit more, I've realized that most of my favorite synths use squares as sub oscs.
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up
In 3.3.2 the problem still not solved unfortunately |
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Hi folks, just interestingly - in S1 v4 did fixed that old problem in Mojito or not ? (Just i not able to check it himself)
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Firstly you must realise you cannot get perfect square wave with this on the main oscillator. But quite close to. The sub seems to mirror what the main oscillator is doing an octave down. It certainly adds weight. On the scope to me the combined wave just looks like a typical oscillator wave doubled with itself an octave lower. All looking OK and sounding fine to me.
If Mojito is to get a face lift it could stay as a single oscillator synth but have 3 or 4 waveforms. It would be nice for the sub to have its own waveforms and have two level controls. One for the main oscillator and the other for the sub. Some nice balances could be done that way. Separate envelope for the filter for some slight more complex sounds. Could take it further and do what the Juno 106 does and that is create a pulse with wave and have an LFO gently manipulate the mark space ratio of the wave. It creates a sort of dual oscillator type of sound. With some chorus and things added it can be very lush.
Specs i5-2500K 3.5 Ghz-8 Gb RAM-Win 7 64 bit - ATI Radeon HD6900 Series - RME HDSP9632 - Midex 8 Midi interface - Faderport 2/8 - Atom Pad/Atom SQ - HP Laptop Win 10 - Studio 24c interface -iMac 2.5Ghz Core i5 - High Sierra 10.13.6 - Focusrite Clarett 2 Pre & Scarlett 18i20. Studio One V5.5 (Mac and V6.5 Win 10 laptop), Notion 6.8, Ableton Live 11 Suite, LaunchPad Pro
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anatolyjbugaichuk wroteHi folks, just interestingly - in S1 v4 did fixed that old problem in Mojito or not ? (Just i not able to check it himself)Mojito's Sub OSC in version 4 behaves like version 3 and not like version 2. I was told by a PreSonus representative the current change is by design (on purpose). |
Jemusic wroteFirstly you must realise you cannot get perfect square wave with this on the main oscillator. But quite close to. The sub seems to mirror what the main oscillator is doing an octave down. It certainly adds weight. On the scope to me the combined wave just looks like a typical oscillator wave doubled with itself an octave lower. All looking OK and sounding fine to me. Frankly, i'm not quite understand what relation all this has to sine (sub osc) wave. niles wroteanatolyjbugaichuk wroteHi folks, just interestingly - in S1 v4 did fixed that old problem in Mojito or not ? (Just i not able to check it himself)Mojito's Sub OSC in version 4 behaves like version 3 and not like version 2. I was told by a PreSonus representative the current change is by design (on purpose). Very fun. Fault became a feature. Well ok no matter, just pity a bit, was a good bass synth. |
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